Greshmahg wrote:(blocks that slit up/down require the blade to be inserted edge down, which dulls the edge)

I put my knives in upside down so the blades doesn't run along the wood and get dull.

Greshmahg wrote:(Putting on knife snob hat):

These knives fall into the mid-range portion of the spectrum. Better than your "Chef Tony Miracle Specials" or your Ginsu's that non-cooks and the newbies use, but nowhere near as nice as the real Shun's, Kasumi's, or Mac's of the world.

They've got some good things going for them: The knife block is slit sideways (blocks that slit up/down require the blade to be inserted edge down, which dulls the edge), and they have a decent Rockwell rating.

The negatives, however, outweigh the benefits. The handles become very slippery when they get wet, which increases the risk of injury. The steel used is not as of high quality as higher end blades. The knives themselves don't have enough heft to them to be considered a "go-to" blade for heavy duty chopping. The balance is not quite right on them given the odd tang design.

I own knives from a lot of manufacturers. Everything from the Kasumi Titaniums to the Mac Ultimate to the ceramic Kyocera Damascus line all the way to the Shun Ken Onion/Kaji/Kramer and Wusthof Grand Prix II lines. I would not welcome these into my collection, and certainly not at this price. If this is your price range for a set of knives, consider the katana line from Calphalon. I'm not so much a fan of those either, but for the price range, they're a better buy.

These are as much Shun knives as Henckel knives with the one-man logo are Henckels compared to the ones with the twin-man logo - which is to say, not really at all.

Thank you for the info. Would you please elaborate on Henckel one man vs two man logo knives.

psychomuse wrote:I don't think ANY cars made by VW are "porches"!

No, but some were campers.

And I've seen some used by rednecks as lawn ornaments.

jmethod81 wrote:He was referring to the fact that VW owns a pretty big chunk of Porsche. And some of their cars are based on the same platform. Mainly the SUV's

Wooooooooosh.

psychomuse wrote:I don't think ANY cars made by VW are "porches"!

". . . and by the way, it isn't a Porsche - it's a Ferrari."

Greshmahg wrote:(Putting on knife snob hat):

They've got some good things going for them: The knife block is slit sideways (blocks that slit up/down require the blade to be inserted edge down, which dulls the edge), and they have a decent Rockwell rating.

These are as much Shun knives as Henckel knives with the one-man logo are Henckels compared to the ones with the twin-man logo - which is to say, not really at all.

I definitely agree with your last comment - however, having worked in the industry and spoken to a number of our designers and engineers, they say the sideways slot thing is a misperception. They all agree that because the metal is significantly harder than the wood (or in this case, most likely bamboo), it won't dull the knives...it will simply eventually destroy your block because the knives will cut into the block when you pull out and put in...

kellywarren wrote:Thank you for the info. Would you please elaborate on Henckel one man vs two man logo knives.

Single Twin knives are made internationally, NOT at their headquarters in Germany. They may be from Portugal or China and the manufacturing quality isn't nearly what the Double Twins are...

Greshmahg wrote:It's impossible to give you a recommendation, because it all depends on what feels good in your hands.
...
I know you said something about Globals, but I have no experience with them. Aside from the fact that I find them about as attractive as a 400 pounder's ass after 4 hours of explosive diarrhea and no toilet paper, they don't feel comfortable in my hand.

I am nowhere near an expert in knives, or cooking, so I feel a little funny weighing in. But I think Global knives are beautiful, and I love how they feel in my hand. I am a woman, so perhaps the handles fit better in my hand than yours because my hand is smaller. I like the weight - not too heavy and not too light. They don't seem out of balance (but what do I know?) And they cut through everything I throw at them with ease. I find them easy to sharpen (with the right sharpening tools) and they are not so far out of my price range that I can't slowly collect them. I would love to try some of the knives you recommend, though - they sound amazing.

I'd love to buy a set of these, but I'm afraid if I paid that much, my wife would use them to sever something I'd rather keep.

These are the knives that Shun made for Crate and Barrel. Much nicer than the Chinese made Pampered Chef's knives.

blanked wrote:from the description these sound stamped not forged as these are not of the 'premium line'. If you care enough about the heft of the knife to spend money on an expensive brand you would want forged for anything other than a travel deboner and a bread knife.

FYI- These knives are made using MIM technology, (metal injection molded). It's pretty high-tech, kind of a modern forging process using powdered steel.

mike137g wrote:if you clean the knives before you stick them in there you wont have to clean inside.. and remind me not to eat in your kitchen if you have insects crawling in there

Silly mike137g, spiders are not insects. Also, I assume you have never had exposure to a professional kitchen...

I would consider this a great deal for a "starter" knife set. A single high-end knife made of quality Japanese steel will run you well over a grand, but this is a good place to start.

Tygress wrote:I am nowhere near an expert in knives, or cooking, so I feel a little funny weighing in. But I think Global knives are beautiful, and I love how they feel in my hand. I am a woman, so perhaps the handles fit better in my hand than yours because my hand is smaller. I like the weight - not too heavy and not too light. They don't seem out of balance (but what do I know?) And they cut through everything I throw at them with ease. I find them easy to sharpen (with the right sharpening tools) and they are not so far out of my price range that I can't slowly collect them. I would love to try some of the knives you recommend, though - they sound amazing.

I agree 100%. I have been a Chef for over 30 years , and I love Global knives. They are absolute razors. This is due to the lack of any bevel angle at the knife cuting edge. The knife is is designed to slope straight from the top edge to the blade. This differs from all other knives that have bevels that range anywhere from 10 to 25 degrees. This is also why the blade stays so sharp so long.

dthacker9 wrote:My culinary hero, Alton Brown, has no end of unkind things to say about the cleanliness of wooden blocks. I'm not taking a stab at this one. (pun intended)
Dave

Ha, he's my hero too!

Wooden blocks are just plain nasty for storing knives... it isn't so much the wood aspect, it's the "block with thin deep slits" part. There's literally NO way to clean the inside of those slits. I suppose you could pour a bleach solution down there, let it sit, then pour it out, but... not so sure you'd wanna use it after that! And I'd bet dollars that even afterwards it still wouldn't be as sanitary as I'd want for storing my good knives.

My knives live in a block that's full of rubbery spindles. I don't know what they're called - picture like a Koosh ball (the spiny looking rubbery things that you squish) only the entire interior of the block is made from those rubber spines. It doesn't have specific slots for each knife; you just stick the blade in wherever it'll fit and the rubber spines cushion it and keep it in position without damaging the blade.

It cost less than $50 (don't recall how much, I've had it for awhile) and the best part is that the rubbery things come right out of the block in a lump and you can put them into the dishwasher for sanitizing, and clean out the inside of the block easily. I love it, I'm even thinking of getting a second one so that I can stop using "knife block is full" as a reason not to buy a sexy new Global.

Maybe it's because I'm not a cook, but I could never see spending $300 on a set of kitchen knives.

elition wrote:I would like to point out that you can buy EIGHTY FOUR pounds of M&M's for $300. For anyone thinking about purchasing this, just think..which will bring more happiness..block-o-knives or EIGHTY FOUR pounds of M&M's!?

24 56oz bags for 300 source

I really, really like you. Just sayin'.

Its obvious to everyone out there that knows anything about knifes that a high quality set is going to cost you WAY more than this. In fact there are some great knifes that cost this price per knife. That being said, I own a bunch of knifes, from different companies, and one of the cheapest I own is my normal, go-to knife. It's a Forschner (SP?) by Victorknox. I love it! It was cheap ($70), hefty, holds a great edge, and you see them in professional kitchens all the time because they stand up to constant use and abuse.

In the end though, I would NEVER buy a knife without holding it first. As many, many chefs will tell you, the best knife in your kitchen is the one that feels perfect in your hand. If you have $300 to buy a good set of knifes, go to the store and hold a ton of them and find the one that fits perfectly in your had. Then make sure it is a high quality knife (ie, forged, full tang, etc.) and buy it. OR pop online after you know what you want and buy it there. It is a rarity that a good knife will be on sale. The people who are looking for them, are willing to pay for them.

Since all the knife people are here today...

Can anyone recommend a good SMALL chef's knife in the $200 to $300 range?

Throw out everything you know from personal experience - it isn't going to apply to me. I'm a five foot tall woman with very small hands, and those hands are severely clawed with arthritis.

I've never felt comfortable handling a 8" knife of any style or brand. You'd imagine the lighter Japanese knives would be better for me, but I've found that a decent heft and full tang make it easier for me to use the knife because the weight sends the blade slicing down through the food with very little effort from my hands. Even a razor-sharp Japanese knife still needs me to push down on it significantly harder than a heavier blade would, and after a few hundred repetitive slicing motions, it makes a difference. I'm not ruling out Japanese knives, just saying that in my situation it makes more sense to look at German first since I can't research every knife on the planet. My hands can't do agility\precision anyway and the weight makes it easier for me. If there's something I'm overlooking here, I'd love to hear it.

My go-to workhorse knife right now is a 6" Wustof Grand Prix II cook's knife with a hollow edged blade (which isn't important to me, that was simply the only one I could afford at the time that wasn't too big for my hands). I've had it for many years and I'm looking to upgrade, but most knives this small aren't really designed for what I need it to do. A thin paring knife or utility blade isn't good enough; I need something designed like a curved chef's knife, just smaller than standard. 7" maximum, preferably 6" or even 5".

Any suggestions appreciated!

abehusky wrote:I'm going to go ahead and assume that you've never actually -tried- using a higher quality knife before. Do yourself a favor and demo a Shun, Wusthof or Henckels chef's knife before making such ignorant statements.

Ignorant? Nope. Let me put it this way: Your $20k car compared to my $80k car has MUCH less style, speed, status, and resale value. And I use it every day. I paid 4x more for my car than you did, and I, daily, feel and enjoy the AT LEAST 4x improvement over what a $20k car would get me. These knives cost 4x more than mine, but I guarantee you the overpriced ones aren't going to make your food taste 4x better, or make your preparation of the food 4x easier or swankier. That is where YOU are ignorant, troll-io.

Boredmaster wrote:Ignorant? Nope. Let me put it this way: Your $20k car compared to my $80k car has MUCH less style, speed, status, and resale value. And I use it every day. I paid 4x more for my car than you did, and I, daily, feel and enjoy the AT LEAST 4x improvement over what a $20k car would get me. These knives cost 4x more than mine, but I guarantee you the overpriced ones aren't going to make your food taste 4x better, or make your preparation of the food 4x easier or swankier.

You're comparing apples to oranges. Your Ferrari gets you to the same place as my Kia, but yours does it in style.

My food tastes the same as yours, but I "got there" in style - with my good knives, it was faster, easier, and more pleasant (and way cooler looking, if you're into status, which I guess you are if you own an $80k car) for me to prepare the food.

Just like it was faster, easier, more pleasant, and much cooler looking for you to drive to work, but we both got to the same job in the end.

People like to spend money on things that improve their lives in the areas they care most about. You, with your Ferrari, care a lot about your driving experience. I, with my Wustof, care about my cooking experience. I'm willing to spend bucks on making cooking more enjoyable, which I do by purchasing the latest and greatest knives, or rather, the knives that work the best for me personally. You do the same with your car.

I cook every day. Sometimes multiple times per day. I'd say I spend more time with my knife in my hand than you do at the wheel of the car.

I don't see any difference here, nor any ignorance.

Not recommended in my opinion. I bought and returned the 6 in. Chef's Knife. It's very sharp but very flimsy and it rusted within 5 days. Got a nick just by cutting through some small fish bones when filleting a fish. The difference in quality is huge between this and the actual Shun knives.

chaospearl wrote:You're comparing apples to oranges. Your Ferrari gets you to the same place as my Kia, but yours does it in style.

My food tastes the same as yours, but I "got there" in style - with my good knives, it was faster, easier, and more pleasant (and way cooler looking, if you're into status, which I guess you are if you own an $80k car) for me to prepare the food.

Just like it was faster, easier, more pleasant, and much cooler looking for you to drive to work, but we both got to the same job in the end.

People like to spend money on things that improve their lives in the areas they care most about. You, with your Ferrari, care a lot about your driving experience. I, with my Wustof, care about my cooking experience. I'm willing to spend bucks on making cooking more enjoyable, which I do by purchasing the latest and greatest knives, or rather, the knives that work the best for me personally. You do the same with your car.

I cook every day. Sometimes multiple times per day. I'd say I spend more time with my knife in my hand than you do at the wheel of the car.

I don't see any difference here, nor any ignorance.

This argument always comes up whenever knives come to woot. For the home cook, I agree that it seems much like a car purchase. In reality, the home cook probably doesn't need a 500 dollar knife. They're motivation would be the prestige of owning a premier knife. In a professional setting, a cheap knife (e.g.$20 stamped) would be adequate for most casual cooks. However, anyone who has upgraded to even wustof knows of its benefits. wustof has several lines around 80-120 a knife that are very solid knives. This being that the steel is better forged, sharper, and harder. The form and balance will be better. All of these contribute to faster, cleaner work.
Upgrade again and you enter the popular japanese makers which are in my opinion over priced but very much better knives than wustof. These are Globals, Shun, and MACs. all very good knives with different approaches to weight, balance, and design. These knives are usually 100-400 but the price does not necessarily dictating that much raise in quality.

Global knives are thin and light, and have relatively soft steel. Slightly harder than wustof but not by much. Shun typically has very hard steel. the classic handles are round and usually right or left handed while their ken onion series has one of the most original handles on the market combining the comfort of a hunting knife with a kitchen knife. I have a set of ken onions that are quite heavy but very comfortable for long hours of prep.
MACs are the newest to enter the large market and people are loving them. They are lighter in weight. Steel is between shun and global in hardenss and have very western style handles. Very good knives. But have gone up 80-100 in price in the last couple years.

Personally, if you care enough about knives to want a shun or mac. It will be better for you to purchase a less popular knife maker with equal or better quality for a lesser or equal price. I posted two very good websites earlier and recommend Glestain and Hattori as brands around 180-300 a knife but these knives are incredible.

I would almost consider the comparison of a good forged knife to a cheap stamped knife as comparing a bike to a car. a bike is a good purchase but has much less of the benefits of life length, speed, and efficiency than a car. A good knife will hold an amazing edge for a long time.

edit: when comparing forge to stamp, forge would be the car, stamp would be the bike.

chaospearl wrote:You're comparing apples to oranges. Your Ferrari gets you to the same place as my Kia, but yours does it in style.

My food tastes the same as yours, but I "got there" in style - with my good knives, it was faster, easier, and more pleasant (and way cooler looking, if you're into status, which I guess you are if you own an $80k car) for me to prepare the food.

Just like it was faster, easier, more pleasant, and much cooler looking for you to drive to work, but we both got to the same job in the end.

People like to spend money on things that improve their lives in the areas they care most about. You, with your Ferrari, care a lot about your driving experience. I, with my Wustof, care about my cooking experience. I'm willing to spend bucks on making cooking more enjoyable, which I do by purchasing the latest and greatest knives, or rather, the knives that work the best for me personally. You do the same with your car.

I cook every day. Sometimes multiple times per day. I'd say I spend more time with my knife in my hand than you do at the wheel of the car.

I don't see any difference here, nor any ignorance.

I agree with you completely. I can see someone who's favorite hobby or job is in the kitchen enjoying this more than, say, my grandmother would enjoy a $300 PS3. And thank you for not calling me ignorant. I'm just focusing on the logic in my "4x better?" argument.

chaospearl wrote:Since all the knife people are here today...

Can anyone recommend a good SMALL chef's knife in the $200 to $300 range?

Throw out everything you know from personal experience - it isn't going to apply to me. I'm a five foot tall woman with very small hands, and those hands are severely clawed with arthritis.

I've never felt comfortable handling a 8" knife of any style or brand. You'd imagine the lighter Japanese knives would be better for me, but I've found that a decent heft and full tang make it easier for me to use the knife because the weight sends the blade slicing down through the food with very little effort from my hands. Even a razor-sharp Japanese knife still needs me to push down on it significantly harder than a heavier blade would, and after a few hundred repetitive slicing motions, it makes a difference. I'm not ruling out Japanese knives, just saying that in my situation it makes more sense to look at German first since I can't research every knife on the planet. My hands can't do agility\precision anyway and the weight makes it easier for me. If there's something I'm overlooking here, I'd love to hear it.

My go-to workhorse knife right now is a 6" Wustof Grand Prix II cook's knife with a hollow edged blade (which isn't important to me, that was simply the only one I could afford at the time that wasn't too big for my hands). I've had it for many years and I'm looking to upgrade, but most knives this small aren't really designed for what I need it to do. A thin paring knife or utility blade isn't good enough; I need something designed like a curved chef's knife, just smaller than standard. 7" maximum, preferably 6" or even 5".

Any suggestions appreciated!

When I first started cooking I used a wustof classic 6" chef.It was easy to handle and create comfort with a sharp knife. I found it a bit handle heavy, and blade light, but I know what you're looking for if thats your comfort zone. If you are anywhere near a Williams Sonoma, they carry Global and Shun knives. A 6 or 7 in Global might be a very good fit for you. They are very light, I would say maybe even lighter than a wustof. The handles are slim compared to wustof but they are slightly better than wustof steel, but may be easier to manipulate.

Shun are much heavier with a slightly larger rounded handed than wustof. Much harder steel will hold an edge much longer, however, be careful, everyone I know has had problems with Shuns chipping. Bear in mind the people I know are all cooks and chefs who use knives 10 hours a day.

MACs are also probably a good option for you. Comparable to wustof or possible slightly lighter their handles are very similar to wustof classic handles, but their steel is much much better in every aspect.

If you are willing to spend that much on a new knife, I would maybe look at hattori here.

I just recently bought a hattori. Rounded version of the wustof handle and feels slightly smaller in diameter. Very Light, most have a nice medium between the hardness of wustof and shun. Very much worth the money. I would much rather have a hattori over a shun with the price difference being 50-100 less per knife. The hattori FH series is very good a series and they are on sale here!


Japanese Knife Warning - Japanese style knives have many more contributing factors to consider. The type of steel can change the hardness but also know that Carbon steel knives stain easily and rust. Many of the cheapest japanese knives are this, so make sure to check.
Many Japanese knives also are right or left handed. To explain: Traditional knives are double beveled 50/50 meaning it tapers on both sides of the blade forming an arch --> /\ however many japanese knives are created on a bias meaning they are more like 60/40 70/30 etc towards a side favoring a handedness. There are also Single bevel knives which are only tapered on one side like a razor --> /| These allow the blade to be much much sharper, but they must be compensated for when using because they do not cut the same way. Be aware of this when you are looking at japanese knives.

Also, when you see the rockwell rating it is the scale of hardness. wustof comes in around 58-59, shun is usually around 62, Personally I prefer around 60-61. Many people think harder the better, for the home use this may be true, I like 60-61 because it allows me to hold an edge through much use, but when it dulls it is much easier for me to sharper. Shun's take almost twice as long to put an edge onto than a wustof maybe more.

That being said, sharpening knives is hugely important if you truly want a worthwhile knife. I recommend ceramic whetstones. They are very expensive but a set of these waterstones can bring any knife back to life. I currently have a system of sharpeners from 300 grit to 12000 grit. This allows me to sharpen a blade much sharper than factory edge and then finish it with a mirror finish. Literally the edge reflects as a mirror.
Naturally when sharpening knives over time you will create your own bevel to a knife as you will naturally favor your knife hand. Creating an even better knife for yourself.

Hope this helps!?

Truelyscrumptious wrote:Wooden blocks are for people that want to show that they have expensive knives but don't use them. That's why I have a magnetic strip that I'm installing up on the wall behind the sink. That's the safest place to store knives for easy access in my kitchen.

Spoken as a non-chef. Wooden blocks, when used correctly, are perfectly fine for storage. I spend a lot of time on the wet stone sharpening my MACs, I would never slap them on a magnetic strip on the wall. Magnetic strips are for cheap utility knives in working kitchens. Ultimately, I prefer my roll.

Are these as good as Wustofs? Which line? Certainly as good as the Gourmet, Emeril, or Silverpoint stamped lines.

These are not Shuns. They are advertised as forged, not stamped as someone else claimed. I have held one of these. They feel cheap relative to a comparable Shun, but, they are a cheaper knife. They didn't feel like a super cheap stamped utility knife though. Basically, I would never recommend buying a knife you haven't held at the least, or hopefully used.

theefen wrote:... 6 or 7 in Global might be a very good fit for you. They are very light, I would say maybe even lighter than a wustof. The handles are slim compared to wustof...

... Shun are much heavier with a slightly larger rounded handed than wustof.

MACs are also probably a good option for you. Comparable to wustof or possible slightly lighter their handles are very similar to wustof ...

I just recently bought a hattori. Rounded version of the wustof handle and feels slightly smaller in diameter.

... That being said, sharpening knives is hugely important if you truly want a worthwhile knife.

Hope this helps!?

It does help, thank you. I think I'm going to look at the Shun and try one out. I do have access to a Williams Sonoma so I'll check there first.

My ideal knife would have a larger but light handle and a heavier blade. Because my hands are so clawed up, it's difficult to grip, so thin narrow handles are a nightmare. At the same time, I prefer a knife where the blade is heavier than the handle. Easier to slice down through food, as I explained in my first post.

As for sharpening, I know most pros would shoot me for this, but I have an electric sharpener. The Chef's Choice 130 that won the Cook's Illustrated tests. I'm aware that manual sharpening is better for my knives, but unfortunately I'm simply not physically able to do it myself. I made a conscious choice that I'd rather get the electric sharpener and be sure my knives are always razor-sharp, even though they may not last as long as if I could sharpen them myself with a whet or water stone. I've never regretted the decision.

I'm not sure the sharpener can handle the single-bevel blade, though - I'll have to check the manual. It may well be okay with it because it sharpens the knife one side at a time using different angled slots for each side. I'll check into that before I go looking at Japanese style knives with the different bevel angles.

chaospearl wrote:Since all the knife people are here today...

Can anyone recommend a good SMALL chef's knife in the $200 to $300 range?

Throw out everything you know from personal experience - it isn't going to apply to me. I'm a five foot tall woman with very small hands, and those hands are severely clawed with arthritis.

I've never felt comfortable handling a 8" knife of any style or brand. You'd imagine the lighter Japanese knives would be better for me, but I've found that a decent heft and full tang make it easier for me to use the knife because the weight sends the blade slicing down through the food with very little effort from my hands. Even a razor-sharp Japanese knife still needs me to push down on it significantly harder than a heavier blade would, and after a few hundred repetitive slicing motions, it makes a difference. I'm not ruling out Japanese knives, just saying that in my situation it makes more sense to look at German first since I can't research every knife on the planet. My hands can't do agility\precision anyway and the weight makes it easier for me. If there's something I'm overlooking here, I'd love to hear it.

My go-to workhorse knife right now is a 6" Wustof Grand Prix II cook's knife with a hollow edged blade (which isn't important to me, that was simply the only one I could afford at the time that wasn't too big for my hands). I've had it for many years and I'm looking to upgrade, but most knives this small aren't really designed for what I need it to do. A thin paring knife or utility blade isn't good enough; I need something designed like a curved chef's knife, just smaller than standard. 7" maximum, preferably 6" or even 5".

Any suggestions appreciated!

I'm a chef, and about the same size as you, small hands, and unfortunately the onset of arthritis in my right (working) hand. Personally, I have two recommendations. I have a MAC that I absolutely love. It isn't the top of the line model because the handles just don't fit my grip. http://amzn.to/gsUGzK I use this knife on a daily basis. Slicing, chopping, fine chiffonade, thin bread slices, this blade does it all. It just took a little bit to get used to a different style of cutting, without the rocking. I actually think the traditional German chef's knife is worse for my arthritis, that the rocking isn't great. That being said, I do like my 6" and 8" Henckles Professional S line Chefs knives. I've had them for 20 years and they are fantastic.

As someone else mentioned, keep them sharpened. That will help you the most. A ceramic steel (~$30) and some great wet/water stones (expensive but worth it) are important if you're going to drop that much money on knives.

If you know any cooks/home cooks ask to take their knives for a spin. It's the best way to figure it out. Global I suspect won't fit your hand, they don't fit mine. Same for the Shun Ken Onion series, but the classic series I love.

Good luck!

chaospearl wrote:It does help, thank you. I think I'm going to look at the Shun and try one out. I do have access to a Williams Sonoma so I'll check there first.

My ideal knife would have a larger but light handle and a heavier blade. Because my hands are so clawed up, it's difficult to grip, so thin narrow handles are a nightmare. At the same time, I prefer a knife where the blade is heavier than the handle. Easier to slice down through food, as I explained in my first post.

As for sharpening, I know most pros would shoot me for this, but I have an electric sharpener. The Chef's Choice 130 that won the Cook's Illustrated tests. I'm aware that manual sharpening is better for my knives, but unfortunately I'm simply not physically able to do it myself. I made a conscious choice that I'd rather get the electric sharpener and be sure my knives are always razor-sharp, even though they may not last as long as if I could sharpen them myself with a whet or water stone. I've never regretted the decision.

I'm not sure the sharpener can handle the single-bevel blade, though - I'll have to check the manual. It may well be okay with it because it sharpens the knife one side at a time using different angled slots for each side. I'll check into that before I go looking at Japanese style knives with the different bevel angles.

Keep in mind, that sharpener is designed for German knives, not Japanese. Most hardware stores have or know of a sharpening service.

JohnnyG29 wrote:Listen...

I held a knife in my hands for at least 8 hours a day 6-7 days a week for over 10 years...

Sometimes it's OK to get caught up in the quality of the steel, forged vs. stamped, plastic handles vs wooden, what celebrity chef uses what brand, weight of the knife, Henckel vs. Forschner, how much you spend on a knife, etc.. But!

If you are reading through this forum trying to decide whether to drop serious cash on this set - DON'T DO IT!

If you want a quality set of knives that look good go to Kmart and get the high end Martha Stewart's for 1/4 this price(trust me, you won't be disappointed).

If you want to be a knife snob and fall into the ridiculous comments and suggestions here spend the cash for an F. D i c k (my personal fav.) I like the shorter German heel and the stouter angle of rock and slightly harder steel as opposed to French designed knives. http://www.boghog.de/en/tools-for-chefs-and-butchers/chef-s-knives/1905-the-exclusive-series/

but ultimately if the knife you currently own works for you then it is the best knife for you - regardless of price, brand name, shape, handle, weight, or what your friends think about it.

There is so much bad advice on this forum today folks - but keep in mind that it's your money! You really don't need to spend hundreds of dollars to get the job done -I worked side by side with a famous chef who used a stamped, plastic handled chef's knife and he swore by it. On the other hand if you're going to spend a few hundred dollars on a knife or set of knives spend the time to do more research (unless you got the cash to burn) but by all means don't be impulsive about your decision. Who knows, this may be the right set for you here today.

Thank you for so sensibly saying what I've been thinking reading so many comments today. As a fellow chef, all I can say is, ditto.

It's always nice to see that there are other things that people obsess over needlessly that isn't the thing that I obsess over needlessly.

It's just a shame Woot never sells lenses.

chaospearl wrote:It does help, thank you. I think I'm going to look at the Shun and try one out. I do have access to a Williams Sonoma so I'll check there first.

My ideal knife would have a larger but light handle and a heavier blade. Because my hands are so clawed up, it's difficult to grip, so thin narrow handles are a nightmare. At the same time, I prefer a knife where the blade is heavier than the handle. Easier to slice down through food, as I explained in my first post.

As for sharpening, I know most pros would shoot me for this, but I have an electric sharpener. The Chef's Choice 130 that won the Cook's Illustrated tests. I'm aware that manual sharpening is better for my knives, but unfortunately I'm simply not physically able to do it myself. I made a conscious choice that I'd rather get the electric sharpener and be sure my knives are always razor-sharp, even though they may not last as long as if I could sharpen them myself with a whet or water stone. I've never regretted the decision.

I'm not sure the sharpener can handle the single-bevel blade, though - I'll have to check the manual. It may well be okay with it because it sharpens the knife one side at a time using different angled slots for each side. I'll check into that before I go looking at Japanese style knives with the different bevel angles.

Electric Sharpener wouldnt be able to handle a single bevel I don't think.

Electric sharpeners work alright. Just know that average 50-100 electric ones only get to about 1000 grit tops. You could buy a double sided 1200-2000 stone (shun makes a relatively cheap one thats meant for smaller knives) and supplement your electric sharpener to allow for a much sharper knife. One knife on a two sided waterstone would only take about 10 minutes to finish. Basically everything over 2000 is just for smoothness.

Cool part of single bevel knives, you only sharpen one side. making sharpening faster. I have a few single bevels. and love them. Especially for delicate work like raw fish and sushi.

I like the zombo.com reference in the description.

theefen wrote:Electric Sharpener wouldnt be able to handle a single bevel I don't think.

Electric sharpeners work alright. Just know that average 50-100 electric ones only get to about 1000 grit tops. You could buy a double sided 1200-2000 stone (shun makes a relatively cheap one thats meant for smaller knives) and supplement your electric sharpener to allow for a much sharper knife. One knife on a two sided waterstone would only take about 10 minutes to finish. Basically everything over 2000 is just for smoothness.

Cool part of single bevel knives, you only sharpen one side. making sharpening faster. I have a few single bevels. and love them. Especially for delicate work like raw fish and sushi.

The problem with manual sharpening isn't how long it takes - I don't care - it's just that I'm simply not able to do it, in a purely physical sense. Hard to explain without you seeing what my hands look like and how they move (or don't move, rather). I can't hold the knife at the correct angle with the stone and still be able to put any pressure while sliding the blade across the surface. Believe me, I've tried.

I used to take my knives to a pro, a local guy who was the chef of a nearby restaurant. Totally obsessed with knives, and he had an impressive collection of various sharpening implements I couldn't even begin to understand. He'd collected them over his lifetime, trying out different ones. Ceramic stones, water stones, Shapton, diamond honing rods, you name it. He moved out of the area a few years ago and I'd asked him beforehand to recommend somebody else to take the knives to; I brought up maybe getting a sharpener for myself. He poo-poo'd the idea of an electric, and tried to teach me to use "proper" sharpening stones. I couldn't do it. We tried all sorts of different equipment and a few MacGyver ideas (rubber grips to help me hold the knife at the right angle, etc) before finally agreeing that my hands just can't do what it takes to properly use a steel or stone.

He eventually recommended the CC 130 as the best electric (in my price range at least - the same company makes pricier ones where you can adjust the angle), and said he wouldn't normally advise it, but for my situation it would be better to go electric and keep my knives sharp instead of thinking that I'm going to go see another pro to hone them for me every week or two. We both knew that wouldn't happen, and I'd end up with horribly dull knives most of the time. The 130 model doesn't have a slot that actually grinds down trashed knives; it basically just does honing, or at least that's all I use it for. I bring the knives to another service my friend recommended every 6 months or so. The electric keeps them razor sharp the rest of the time. As I said, I've never regretted it.

There is another model that can do 15 degree angle Japanese knives, single or double bevel. If I upgrade my knife to one of that style, I'll sell my current sharpener on eBay and switch to the pricier one. Now that I know I have to be careful to check the specifics on any knife I'm considering. I think it'd be easier to stick with a traditional 20-degree angle western style knife.

Tygress wrote:I am nowhere near an expert in knives, or cooking, so I feel a little funny weighing in. But I think Global knives are beautiful, and I love how they feel in my hand. I am a woman, so perhaps the handles fit better in my hand than yours because my hand is smaller. I like the weight - not too heavy and not too light. They don't seem out of balance (but what do I know?) And they cut through everything I throw at them with ease. I find them easy to sharpen (with the right sharpening tools) and they are not so far out of my price range that I can't slowly collect them. I would love to try some of the knives you recommend, though - they sound amazing.

And that's the beauty of knives. They're such a personal decision . What works for me might not work for you (if you like Globals, you would absolutely LOATHE my Twin Cuisines or my Mac Ultimates, for example). It's a wonderful thing that we have so many options and that no matter what your preference, there's a perfect knife for you out there.

theefen wrote:Electric Sharpener wouldnt be able to handle a single bevel I don't think.

Electric sharpeners work alright. Just know that average 50-100 electric ones only get to about 1000 grit tops. You could buy a double sided 1200-2000 stone (shun makes a relatively cheap one thats meant for smaller knives) and supplement your electric sharpener to allow for a much sharper knife. One knife on a two sided waterstone would only take about 10 minutes to finish. Basically everything over 2000 is just for smoothness.

Cool part of single bevel knives, you only sharpen one side. making sharpening faster. I have a few single bevels. and love them. Especially for delicate work like raw fish and sushi.

Or use a paper wheel. One of the top choices for game processors and packers these days (their knives have to take abuse and do things that a single cook's knife wouldn't be adequate for).

And speaking of game processing and packing houses, for anyone who thinks they simply must have what "everybody else is using professionally", I can guarantee you that none of them use anything like this. Their knives are about $5-$10, they get sharpened every night, and dull out about 3 per day in a 10 hour shift. The knives themselves go from 8" to 6" in a few weeks (due to being softer steel and being sharpened nightly). Part of that is due to economics of scale and part of that is the different tasks required and methods used. Likewise a chef would never consider using that type of knife, because he or she would want a rigid blade, a hard edge with a specific bevel, and would have various styles for each task (in addition to million other specialized implements).

Think about what you want the tool to do, how you want that tool to fit your hand, how you will store it and forget all the hoopla over hardness, style, all that. Just get what you can afford. It is like a guitar; you have a lot of choices for scale, frets, width, neck radius, weight and materials, get one and you'll know later what you do and don't like about it. SRV played a common old fashioned stratocaster, it was him not the guitar.

chaospearl wrote:Since all the knife people are here today...

Can anyone recommend a good SMALL chef's knife in the $200 to $300 range?

Throw out everything you know from personal experience - it isn't going to apply to me. I'm a five foot tall woman with very small hands, and those hands are severely clawed with arthritis.

I've never felt comfortable handling a 8" knife of any style or brand. You'd imagine the lighter Japanese knives would be better for me, but I've found that a decent heft and full tang make it easier for me to use the knife because the weight sends the blade slicing down through the food with very little effort from my hands. Even a razor-sharp Japanese knife still needs me to push down on it significantly harder than a heavier blade would, and after a few hundred repetitive slicing motions, it makes a difference. I'm not ruling out Japanese knives, just saying that in my situation it makes more sense to look at German first since I can't research every knife on the planet. My hands can't do agility\precision anyway and the weight makes it easier for me. If there's something I'm overlooking here, I'd love to hear it.

My go-to workhorse knife right now is a 6" Wustof Grand Prix II cook's knife with a hollow edged blade (which isn't important to me, that was simply the only one I could afford at the time that wasn't too big for my hands). I've had it for many years and I'm looking to upgrade, but most knives this small aren't really designed for what I need it to do. A thin paring knife or utility blade isn't good enough; I need something designed like a curved chef's knife, just smaller than standard. 7" maximum, preferably 6" or even 5".

Any suggestions appreciated!

If you can get ahold of Shun Ken Onion to try out, that might be a great option for you. The handle design is so unique, it might fit you perfectly (or it might be the most uncomfortable thing you've ever held).

As an aside, have you looked into ceramics? I know you said you've found you prefer heavier knives because you don't like having to "push down" repeatedly, but a really nice ceramic knife can cut through almost anything like butter - you don't really have to apply any pressure. Again, it might not work for your situation, but it's worth looking into. The Damascus line from Kyocera is quite nice.

As to your comment about how you sharpen them with the electrical thing, might I recommend something like this , at least for your more frequent honings or on the fly sharpenings.

When it comes to a full-on sharpening session, I take my blades to a professional for 2 dollars a blade. It's just worth it to me to go about it that way vs doing it myself, but I use that universal deal from Anolon for all of my honing or mild grinding.

Meh. If you change out the power supply, maybe you could upgrade the graphics card. Then again, if you don't make it yourself at home you are just part of the fascist "machine."

Looks like they've sold 35 of them so far. Woot keeps selling knives, so someone must be buying them....

skrutinizr wrote:Meh. If you change out the power supply, maybe you could upgrade the graphics card. Then again, if you don't make it yourself at home you are just part of the fascist "machine."

Quality post with a capital K!