ElGuappo


quality posts: 7 Private Messages ElGuappo
cordellt wrote:I have an old dell(xps 720) with an intel extreme 2.93, 4 mgs of ddr2 ram and a 8800 ultra video card. The computer was very fast 5 years ago but now takes forever to boot up and I get frequent blue screens and freezes. The only game I play is WOW. Would this refurb be ok on medium settings?



you should see a huge improvement in both stability and fps, assuming wow has embraced win8 (surely they have).

One thing that can help any machine is if you use a lot of USB powered accessories, get a powered USB hub and let the hub supply that power. Things like backlit keyboards, external USB drives, woot-off lights, camcorder and phone chargers, bluetooth modules, whatever else you plug into the USB ports nearly all suck some power.

ElGuappo


quality posts: 7 Private Messages ElGuappo
gak0090 wrote:You would probably need to update the OS since Crays usually run Linux or Unix type OS.




usually Linux? Really? Your posts always bring a laugh, but we're laughing at you, not with you...

ElGuappo


quality posts: 7 Private Messages ElGuappo
gak0090 wrote: There is not many people that actually use beyond 4GB of memory (unless you are running several virtual OS's or have some other unique setup), 8GB is usually a sweet spot.



4G is enough for nearly everyone which means that the "sweet spot" is 8G? Please, enlighten us. Are all mobos and BIOS the same?

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
skrutinizr wrote:Woot could offer a Cray supercomputer and everyone will say you have to upgrade the GPU and power supply before you can run a game on it.

Whatever.



No one is saying you have to upgrade them to play games on this machine, but if you want most games to run well, this machine just won't cut it.
Are you trying to say that this machine can run most new games with only 1GB of GDDR3 video memory?
Most new games would have to run on low settings, and a game like Crysis would probably run in stop-motion regardless of settings.

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
kellic wrote:Pfft. Most computers ARE gaming PC's now a days with a bit of augmentation. Add a better GPU, add faster RAM, add an SSD. The core system and most CPU's will easily run any game you throw at it. Its the GPU that most systems lack. Oh and a good power supply. You get about 80% of what you need in a moderate gaming rig and for cheap too.



At that point, wouldn't it just be better to either a) build your own PC, or b) just buy one with better hardware?

Buying this and replacing the RAM, PSU, GPU, and putting in an SSD would almost surely be more expensive than just doing A or B above.

bobcline


quality posts: 0 Private Messages bobcline

I have one.
Don't do it.
Crappy video card.
I've been waiting 2+ weeks for a mother board and CPU repair.

Don't believe me?
Call HP support first and witness the run around first hand. If you speak Chinese you may enjoy it.

Try to upgrade the video card and find out how you need to unlock the BIOS to upgrade the system - a real hassell.


gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
bobcline wrote:I have one.
Don't do it.
Crappy video card.
I've been waiting 2+ weeks for a mother board and CPU repair.

Don't believe me?
Call HP support first and witness the run around first hand. If you speak Chinese you may enjoy it.

Try to upgrade the video card and find out how you need to unlock the BIOS to upgrade the system - a real hassell.



Yes upgrading the videocard is definitely more hassle then it use to be, but this is partly the fault of Windows 8 and the UEFI Bios. This sounds like a solution:

"I did however disabled the UEFI/Secure boot and enabled legacy mode before swapping cards."

http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/375568-31-graphics-card-issues-prebuilt-1414

Too bad it's not windows 7, this would not have been an issue.

indetrucks


quality posts: 3 Private Messages indetrucks
jaykid007 wrote:If I add a second ssd drive, will the psu be ok?



You will be fine. An SSD uses a fraction of the power that an HDD uses.

cstanek42


quality posts: 1 Private Messages cstanek42

For those that bought this model, how large is the case interior?

I bought a refurb HP from woot! several years ago and it's worked fantastic, but the inside is really tight so it's been hard to do upgrades.

Thanks!

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
cstanek42 wrote:For those that bought this model, how large is the case interior?

I bought a refurb HP from woot! several years ago and it's worked fantastic, but the inside is really tight so it's been hard to do upgrades.

Thanks!



I found this:
http://superuser.com/questions/541344/mounting-another-hard-drive-to-a-hp-envy-h8-1414

ndk0911


quality posts: 1 Private Messages ndk0911

or you could format that HD and drop a Linux OS for FREE!! and it doesnt look like a fourth grader desighned your desktop...

edemusmaximus


quality posts: 0 Private Messages edemusmaximus

Honestly, who still uses computers or information getting devices? Its like the 21st centuree.

ed

jdean


quality posts: 0 Private Messages jdean

Windows 8, meh.

Sageomithas


quality posts: 0 Private Messages Sageomithas
gak0090 wrote:You would probably need to update the OS since Crays usually run Linux or Unix type OS. I'm not quite sure if you could get Windows to load on a Cray.

edit: actually they did make one that ran windows server

http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/blog/2008/sep/16/windows.microsoft

this one probably would not need any upgrades (although your home would probably require some rewiring):

http://www.forbes.com/sites/alexknapp/2012/11/13/cray-claims-the-fastest-supercomputing-crown-with-the-nvidia-powered-titan/



Why bother running Windows on the Cray, Steam now has linux support so you can game on it already...

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb

It's amusing to see people still whining about Windows 8. It's actually a very good OS once you get over the "Oh noes! It's different!" hysteria.

If you are *really* that bothered, for a couple of bucks you can install Start8, which restores the old start menu.

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
Sageomithas wrote:Why bother running Windows on the Cray, Steam now has linux support so you can game on it already...



Sweet. It's time for me to get more familiar with linux.

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
Sageomithas wrote:Why bother running Windows on the Cray, Steam now has linux support so you can game on it already...



Yeah, there is such a huge selection of good games for available for Linux... Pfft.

Just because games compatible with Linux can be purchased from Steam doesn't mean that suddenly major developers are going to release their games for the OS. It's such a niche market, that they're not even going to bother.

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
k2wananb wrote:It's amusing to see people still whining about Windows 8. It's actually a very good OS once you get over the "Oh noes! It's different!" hysteria.

If you are *really* that bothered, for a couple of bucks you can install Start8, which restores the old start menu.



Classic shell does it for free. http://www.classicshell.net/

The thing it doesn't do though is fix the deal with the UEFI Bios- Windows 8 thing which makes upgrading hardware a pain, or installing linux. And Windows 8 still doesn't have mediacenter, which means you have to pay for a separate download. I don't hate Windows 8, in fact I love the way it works on my ExoPc tablet- I just prefer windows 7 on non-touch PCs.

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
gak0090 wrote:Classic shell does it for free. http://www.classicshell.net/

The thing it doesn't do though is fix the deal with the UEFI Bios- Windows 8 thing which makes upgrading hardware a pain, or installing linux. And Windows 8 still doesn't have mediacenter, which means you have to pay for a separate download. I don't hate Windows 8, in fact I love the way it works on my ExoPc tablet- I just prefer windows 7 on non-touch PCs.



It's available as an add-on for Windows 8
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/feature-packs

That said, I've found software like Plex or XBMC to be better than any version of WMC.

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
k2wananb wrote:It's available as an add-on for Windows 8
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/feature-packs

That said, I've found software like Plex or XBMC to be better than any version of WMC.



I do use XBMC hub, and really like it. It's got a huge amount of potential but still has bugs when installing some of the add-ons. Comparing functionality XBMC looks way cooler. I also have Ceton inifintv cablecards- and these primarily work in mediacenter. Not to say that they won't work in XBMC, but it's not an easy setup.

indetrucks


quality posts: 3 Private Messages indetrucks
k2wananb wrote:It's available as an add-on for Windows 8
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/feature-packs

That said, I've found software like Plex or XBMC to be better than any version of WMC.


I still don't understand people complaining about W8. I honestly feel that 50% of the people who complain about W8, have never actually used it. They have just "heard" about it.

You would be hard pressed to hear a REAL tech geek complain about W8 as there are all types of ways around the things you don't like about it.

That being said, I have W8 on my machines and NEVER have used the app's. This is not an Iphone, leave "apps" off it.

/rant

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
indetrucks wrote:I still don't understand people complaining about W8. I honestly feel that 50% of the people who complain about W8, have never actually used it. They have just "heard" about it.

You would be hard pressed to hear a REAL tech geek complain about W8 as there are all types of ways around the things you don't like about it.

That being said, I have W8 on my machines and NEVER have used the app's. This is not an Iphone, leave "apps" off it.

/rant



Exactly. I've found Windows 8 to be a very light OS. I've been using Windows since 3.1, and I've never seen any version start up so fast. Windows 7 was a great OS, and I really liked it, but in my experience, it's not this fast and smooth.

Once you get your Start screen set up with tiles to programs you use frequently, I've actually found that I prefer it over the old start menu.

And like you said, if someone can't get over the "Oh noes! It's different!" aspect, then there are tons of workarounds to add the old start menu. But, I think if most people would simply give it a chance, they'd realize that it's really not necessary.

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
ElGuappo wrote:usually Linux? Really? Your posts always bring a laugh, but we're laughing at you, not with you...



Since the moderator removed my other posts... I'll be kinder this time

well over 90% of the world top 500 supercomputers are running Linux.


http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/fast-faster-fastest-linux-rules-supercomputing/11263

whose laughing now?

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
gak0090 wrote:Since the moderator removed my other posts... I'll be kinder this time

well over 90% of the world top 500 supercomputers are running Linux.


http://www.zdnet.com/blog/open-source/fast-faster-fastest-linux-rules-supercomputing/11263

whose laughing now?




So because many supercomputers use Linux it's somehow a better OS for personal computing?
Sure, you can do some cool things with Linux, but with the easy availability of software and games for Windows and OS X, there's really no reason for anyone to use it other than to be trendy.

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
ElGuappo wrote:4G is enough for nearly everyone which means that the "sweet spot" is 8G? Please, enlighten us. Are all mobos and BIOS the same?



The amount of RAM that is generally being utilized in a 64 bit windows OS will generally range from 2-3 GB from background processes only, to multiple programs running beside background processes. If the CPU has a graphics core then you will have to allot some memory for that. Then you should have some extra memory for headroom. 8 GB is a fair amount of RAM, can be purchased fairly cheaply as 2 x 4Gb to still allow for dual channel memory bandwidth. Outside of using virtual OS's or servers this should be plenty for most people. I work with this amount of memory and still have enough to dedicate to virtual OS's. Almost any modern motherboard chipset that is in desktop configuration can support 8gb RAM. Consider yourself enlightened "ElGuappo".

Hopefully this is better worded to please the moderators

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
k2wananb wrote:So because many supercomputers use Linux it's somehow a better OS for personal computing?
Sure, you can do some cool things with Linux, but with the easy availability of software and games for Windows and OS X, there's really no reason for anyone to use it other than to be trendy.



Did you follow the whole previous thread from "ElGuappo"? It had nothing to do with using it with regards to personal computing (you have to go back some posts).

But since we're on the subject, Android is a Linux based OS. I would not consider that trendy, those tablets are taking market share away from traditional PCs.

rayh22


quality posts: 0 Private Messages rayh22

I would get this in a heartbeat but have money sitting in my Amazon account and the last time I checked you couldn't buy anything Woot with those funds.

k2wananb


quality posts: 12 Private Messages k2wananb
gak0090 wrote:Did you follow the whole previous thread from "ElGuappo"? It had nothing to do with using it with regards to personal computing (you have to go back some posts).

But since we're on the subject, Android is a Linux based OS. I would not consider that trendy, those tablets are taking market share away from traditional PCs.



Android is a great OS in the context of portable devices, but in terms of productivity, (and even in entertainment) it's a long way from replacing traditional PCs.

RickinDuxbury1


quality posts: 0 Private Messages RickinDuxbury1
icealong wrote:Can someone lend me a hand? I really need a new PC and I had all the parts for one and it was gonna be $800 but this would save me tons. I want to use it for browsing the web and watching youtube but the occasional gaming here and there(not likely newest games)
I'm also really skeptical if I should buy it because its refurbished. Refurbished electronics are usually a no-no.



Do not buy this without the Square Trade Warranty. I bought an HP Pavilion DV7 laptop 18 months ago from Woot and it died this week. Heat sink isn't working and repair is the price of a new computer. Warranty is great but lots of documents lost. (Yeah, I know I should back up or use the cloud.I should also floss twice a day). HP refurbs are bad news.

MichXelle


quality posts: 38 Private Messages MichXelle
AerodexdotCom wrote:UPS just delivered this nearly same PC from last weeks sale today. The first thing I did was install a great Windows 8 enhancement called "Classic Shell".

I have Classic Shell installed on several Windows 7 machines.

Classic Shell is a collection of usability enhancements for Windows. The main features are:
Highly customizable start menu with multiple styles and skins
Start button for Windows 7 and Windows 8
Toolbar and status bar for Windows Explorer
Caption and status bar for Internet Explorer

Classic Shell has more than 6 million downloads.

Get back the look and feel of Windows XP and keep the enhancements/performance of Win8.
Price? Free www.ClassicShell.net



We got ours recently, and its rolling beautifully. Thanks for the information about Classic Shell, we'll be looking into it.

We're pleased with the purchase and know of no one else with a Hexacore system. The IT directorof our sub-company felt this was a great home desktop. We're not gamers but are involved with graphics. This will be for ALL the basics and graphics. If we want to try playing a game, we will. For under $500 for a Hexacore that can be upgraded to a huge amount of RAM, we're content.

I think too many of you can't afford this desktop with the upgrades you want, so you're crying in your spilt milk. If you have nothing decent to say, don't bother.

OVER 550 W00T CARTFULS as of 06/25/14. You're killing us with some wonderful items W000T!

OVER 8 years on W00T shopping and The W00T Forum, since 02/06 with now a whopping 34 Quality Posts L-M-A-O! We do post quality information as do others that isn't recognized. Thanks for the 3 in 1 entire week! We're humbled. 3 additional noticed in 3 months. No more positive posts as our are not noticed.

MichXelle


quality posts: 38 Private Messages MichXelle
k2wananb wrote:At that point, wouldn't it just be better to either a) build your own PC, or b) just buy one with better hardware?

Buying this and replacing the RAM, PSU, GPU, and putting in an SSD would almost surely be more expensive than just doing A or B above.


Figure out the cost to build 1 compared to all the components in this desktop upgraded. If you can afford it, go build it as no one normally has dedicated video cards and the addtl this has in a non custom built machine.

Goodnight, sleep tight kids.

OVER 550 W00T CARTFULS as of 06/25/14. You're killing us with some wonderful items W000T!

OVER 8 years on W00T shopping and The W00T Forum, since 02/06 with now a whopping 34 Quality Posts L-M-A-O! We do post quality information as do others that isn't recognized. Thanks for the 3 in 1 entire week! We're humbled. 3 additional noticed in 3 months. No more positive posts as our are not noticed.

Samus


quality posts: 20 Private Messages Samus

LOL a the guy who says you need a 800 watt PSU.

I ran SLI GTX460's (and eventually upgraded to SLI GTX570's) in a first-gen Core i7 950 (135w chip) in an Asus x58 board + six 2GB DIMMS (12GB) in dual-triple channel, WITH 3 hard drives and an SSD, AND a USB 3.0 add-on card.

I guess my 600-watt PC Power & Cooling PSU didn't cut it all those years?

My measured "full-load" at the wall in furmark was still 535 watts, and furmark is beyond any real world workload.

High amp PSU's are generally unnecessary. It has more to do with the quality and design. 500-watts is good for anybody running the latest CPU and GPU with a few drives.

I agree, this machine with 300 watts won't run any decent video card, but should be adequate as-is running stock hardware.

Also, keep in mind IF you do have a 800-watt PSU and your load is either low (<100-watts, ie, idle) or max is 300-400 watts, you will run into efficiency issues. PSU's run most efficient around 90% load, and are VERY inefficient below 10% load.

rljmoreno


quality posts: 0 Private Messages rljmoreno

I'm considering buying one, but need some feedback on delivery, and condition of product when arrived? I have heard some horror stories of deliveries made with boxes damaged....broken products....you get the picture....

AerodexdotCom


quality posts: 4 Private Messages AerodexdotCom
gak0090 wrote:You would be lucky if they used that configuration. I would guess they are doing 4+4+2, meaning that they are losing the dual channel bandwidth. If you pull the side off and see this, your best bet would be to pull off that last 2GB module. There is not many people that actually use beyond 4GB of memory (unless you are running several virtual OS's or have some other unique setup), 8GB is usually a sweet spot.

I tried your suggestion, measuring memory speed before and after with the windows performance tool. Showed 7.4 with 4+4+2. Showed 7.6 with 4+4...a measly 2.7% increase. Put the 2gb stick back in, 2.7% speed increase is not worth the tradeoff.

A

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
AerodexdotCom wrote:I tried your suggestion, measuring memory speed before and after with the windows performance tool. Showed 7.4 with 4+4+2. Showed 7.6 with 4+4...a measly 2.7% increase. Put the 2gb stick back in, 2.7% speed increase is not worth the tradeoff.



The performance tool doesn't only measure memory bandwidth, but it also measures other benchmarks. This will show you about the memory bandwidth difference http://www.legitreviews.com/article/1779/3/ Having said that, the dual channel memory will have more effect on memory intensive operations and negligible effect on programs that aren't so memory intensive. My argument though is that out of 10gb of memory, really only about 3-4GB is ever used (install a RAM utilization gadget and you'll see). So if your never going to use those 2gb, why leave them installed? Realize that HP uses this for pure marketing purposes, because 1) no one even uses 2gb ram modules because of how cheap the 4gb Ram modules are- so the price on these is way cheap 2)People will see 10gb RAM and automatically think it's better than 8GB, when in fact it's a cheap marketing ploy.

If you buy another 2gb for about $20 then it will restore the dual channel. I consider myself a power user doing virtual OS's and video encoding, transcoding... and I never even come close to utilizing all 8 GB.

mikelindo


quality posts: 0 Private Messages mikelindo
gak0090 wrote:1)The benchmarks are not low. The Passmark is 5855 which is I5 range
2)The HD 7450 is pretty weak as far as gaming goes. But it does have HDMI out and the card is fine for an HTPC. Regular tasks/programs will run fine under this card.
3) 300 watt power supply will run as configured. If you update the videocard you'll need to update the PS
4)Windows 8-I agree is an annoyance on a non touchscreen. In addition, if you decide to set this up as an HTPC, you'll have to download (and pay for) windows mediacenter. Alternatively you could use a different program like XBMC Hub for your mediacenter.

This is an OK deal. Not horrible not great. Not good for gamers, but decent processing power for a nice workstation or HTPC mediacenter.



I'm replying to this days later just to make my point -- you basically summed up EXACTLY what I said in different words. This is NOT a gaming computer. Much less a hard-core gaming machine. It was built for multimedia and that's what it'll do best. And yes, if you do your research, you'll see that the CPU is pretty weak for gaming. But yea, if it makes you feel smart, that's cool too...

eagleville


quality posts: 0 Private Messages eagleville

My bad - paying the price for being a Win8 newbie - this comes with "Win8" which is the equivalent of the home version and won't register on my work domain so I had to shell out for the Win8 Pro Upgrade.
It still seems to be a good deal, but next time I'll be more careful with the specs.

gak0090


quality posts: 78 Private Messages gak0090
mikelindo wrote:I'm replying to this days later just to make my point -- you basically summed up EXACTLY what I said in different words. This is NOT a gaming computer. Much less a hard-core gaming machine. It was built for multimedia and that's what it'll do best. And yes, if you do your research, you'll see that the CPU is pretty weak for gaming. But yea, if it makes you feel smart, that's cool too...



GPU is you main player in gaming performance- CPU plays a marginal role.


this is what you said:
1. FX-6120 - Benchmarks pretty low

This is simply not accurate. The passmark is 5855. The point I was making is that this does make a good workstation- you pretty much missed that in your assessment, in addition you mislead people to thinking that the CPU has poor performance. So basically I summed up some of what you said, and corrected the mistakes.