CowBear wrote:Hmmm interesting product but it seems like a wireless bridge is still the better way to go.

Sure, if you're in decent range of your wireless router... In which case, why wouldn't you just use your computer's built-in wireless (or get built-in wireless) instead? What if your house is a brick/concrete bunker?

This is great for things that can not be "wireless" like a SlingBox. This could make your SlingBox virtually wireless.

Neat idea

fencepost wrote:85 Mbit isn't so bad, but 56-bit encryption? Can't you crack that with a graphics card in about 30 seconds?

Yeah, after you physically break into the house you can. It's WIRED.

showcaller wrote:These things, like many balderah techie gizmos, don't even seem like a good idea for fifteen seconds, at which point you ask yourself, "is this really worth the hassle and aggravation?" Woot offers many cool, groovy items from close outs to stuff that just didn't make it in the marketplace. This isn't one of them. This is just wierd and a hassle all rolled into two packages.

Sorry you think that way, I've been meaning to pick up some powerline adapters for almost a year now (always been too expensive). They are an excellent way to transfer your home network to areas where there is no wireless or where you have devices that don't have wireless access, such as the Xbox 360.

phil12021 wrote:To woot or not to woot... that is the question.

I have a wireless network set up in my home office and would love to be able to connect my DirecTV and bluray in the living room all to the network. The rooms are both downstairs I assume this would work by connection the single to my router now and then the 4 outlet one on the other end.

Or is there a wireless solution I don't know about which would be better? Many are suggesting going wireless instead... what product would I need?

I somewhat echo Phil's question. I have a Mac (yes, I said it) with Airport running a wireless network from my upstairs office. I just bought a Netflix streaming LG Network Blu-ray as well as a Wii which are located downstairs. Netflix recommends a direct ethernet connection or a powerline type solution. Can I link this from Airport and use it for my gaming and movie streaming downstairs?

kudv4yn3 wrote:Just so everyone knows....PoE (power over ethernet) kits, are Cabbage Patch Elvis. There are so many things that can make these randomly stop working...
microwaves
cordless phones
cell phones
SURGE PROTECTORS...thats right, you cant use surge protectors with these or they wont work....
so yeah...if you dont have ANY OF THE ABOVE ITEMS, i think its safe to say youll be safe in your purchase...otherwise, Run an ethernet cable, put up access points, but a range extender...anything but these things.

i work for microcenter, and every one of these that i have sold have come back.

Well, unfortunately this answer is classic example of retail experience bias (I will shamelessly add that MicroCenter is a great retail outlet).

The only item I would recommend any reader of this thread consider from this post is the statement regarding surge protectors: a well-made UPS and/or surge protector would indeed stop HomePlug signals. Fortunately (or unfortunately) very few surge strips actually provide the isolation that would block HomePlug, though best practice remains to bypass them for this device.

Good luck!

Jon

Ok how much for an extra box or would I be better off just buying two of these so I have 4 boxes.

Wow. Just, I mean just (9:30PM), bought this same pair at BB because a lightening strike took out my old ones. Going back as soon as these get here ;-)

Ok, pretty sure I'm in for one, but if you get two, can you use the other two in two more places in the house? Basically, does it matter which one of these, the 1 port or the 4 port, is connected directly to your router?

i24u wrote:Ok how much for an extra box or would I be better off just buying two of these so I have 4 boxes.

Ha, just looked into that, and basically it is about 60 bucks for just one, so this is a deluxe deal, assuming it doesn't matter where you put either of them.

fencepost wrote:85 Mbit isn't so bad, but 56-bit encryption? Can't you crack that with a graphics card in about 30 seconds?

Yeah, 56 bit DES isn't the strongest encryption in the world.

All the graphics card cracks are essentially doing a dictionary search of possible passwords; this system probably picks a random 56 bit value as the key. But, even with a random 56 bit value, DES is pretty weak; most systems that use DES have gone to triple DES, or they have abandoned DES completely and gone to AES.

bungle wrote:
CowBear wrote:
Hmmm interesting product but it seems like a wireless bridge is still the better way to go.
Agreed.

Ummm, NO. you both don't know what you're talking about. Wireline has been developing since 2000.
(basic) How Power-line Networking Works
FYI- "Many old 85 Mbit/s devices are erroneously referred to be HomePlug. They are instead based on Intellon's proprietary 85 Mbit/s Turbo mode."

Catbertthegreat wrote:You can only crack the encryption if your in the house and hooked in to the network. The signal can't travel past the master breaker in your home, so it can't go out to the pole.

The signal can certainly pass by your master breaker; how would a breaker stop the signal?

The only thing that will stop it is the transformer; which means that your neighbors may be able to listen in.

Will the Powerline Networking signal pass through circuit breakers?
Yes, the Powerline Networking signal will have no problem passing through circuit breakers but not through power transformers (those big cyclinders that hang on telephone poles). So essentially all of the outlets you use must be on the same breaker box.

peach73 wrote:Anyone know the real range on this? Say for instance, would it work in a large business like a hotel with tons of power outlets or would there be a considerable drop/down grade in quality of the signal?

These wont work very long distances or through a transformer. They also have problems when they are near inductive (anything with a motor) loads. Even if you could get past the signal quality issues they don't scale well as its a half-duples bus network with all units sharing the same bandwidth.

slba34g wrote:I feel dumb asking this question, but does this replace my internet that I pay for every month?

It is does not replace your internet. It connects to yoru modem or router to allow you to connect to your home network in some other part of your house using the electric wiring of the house instead of wifi or having a long cable from modem to computer in other part of your house. You still need to have either DSL or cable coming in to your house to a modem.

slba34g wrote:I feel dumb asking this question, but does this replace my internet that I pay for every month?

Ah, but the bravery to ask the dumb question is the real wisdom, now innit?

do i get 1 or 2?

gimpyestrada wrote:Bottom line is that (for now) wires are almost always going to be better than no wires. Anyone who tells you different doesn't know what they're talking about.

About Wi-Fi: "It's not a wire, and no matter how much you try, it will never be a wire"

bungle wrote:Agreed.

It depends what you are trying to do. Wireless networks are subject to any RFI that your neighbors might emit. You also compete for bandwith with them if you are on the same (or close) channel.

With powerline networks you have a relatively closed network with a lot more reliability. I use these things to connect my HTPC to my wired network and I never have the problems I used to on wireless.

this might be a dumb question...
i share internet with my neighbor next door of an apartment building through his wi-fi network...
would this still work even if its separate apartments? we're both on the first floor of the building...
would it increase the speed to that of a hardline?

So are they selling the PLTK300 or the PLTE200? The title and box picture shows up as the 300 model but the description is of the old model.

Shellyfish wrote:I somewhat echo Phil's question. I have a Mac (yes, I said it) with Airport running a wireless network from my upstairs office. I just bought a Netflix streaming LG Network Blu-ray as well as a Wii which are located downstairs. Netflix recommends a direct ethernet connection or a powerline type solution. Can I link this from Airport and use it for my gaming and movie streaming downstairs?

You are better off with these than wireless. They are far more reliable.

kudv4yn3 wrote:Just so everyone knows....PoE (power over ethernet) kits, are Cabbage Patch Elvis. There are so many things that can make these randomly stop working...
microwaves
cordless phones
cell phones
SURGE PROTECTORS...thats right, you cant use surge protectors with these or they wont work....
so yeah...if you dont have ANY OF THE ABOVE ITEMS, i think its safe to say youll be safe in your purchase...otherwise, Run an ethernet cable, put up access points, but a range extender...anything but these things.

i work for microcenter, and every one of these that i have sold have come back.

PoE != PLC

Does it work with mac too?

Although I don't have this exact setup I do use another powerline adapter. I am pleased with the technology. Was using wireless but it would drop the connection every couple of days and required a repair on the adapter. Although I get faster transfers with the wireless N, the powerline adapters are very stable and perfect for my situation.

bsl918 wrote:So are they selling the PLTK300 or the PLTE200? The title and box picture shows up as the 300 model but the description is of the old model.

I was thinking the same thing. What model number woot.

So what I've gleaned from the conversation thus far is that these are way better than wireless and are very reliable. Also, these are terrible in comparison to wireless and don't work reliably.

Thanks for the advice fellow wooters, I'm off to string up some cat-5. Maybe I'll hang Christmas lights from it and pretend it's all part of the decoration.

:D

fencepost wrote:85 Mbit isn't so bad, but 56-bit encryption? Can't you crack that with a graphics card in about 30 seconds?

are you worried about hackers coming into your house and tapping into your power? If so, yes, 56bit DES is slightly worrisome.

To clear up some strange and misleading naming conventions adopted by Cisco/Linksys on this product, based on the datasheets at:

http://downloads.linksysbycisco.com/downloads/PLK300_V10_DS_A,0.pdf
http://downloads.linksysbycisco.com/downloads/PLTK300_V10_DS_A-WEB.pdf

The PLK300 kit (not Woot's offering) has:
PLE300 and PLS300 (128bit encryption, 200Mbps)

The PLTK300 kit (Woot's offering) has:
PLE200 and PLS200 (56bit encryption, 85Mbps)

The 'T' (for Turbo) in PLTK300 makes it seems like it would be faster than the PLK300, but it's not.

As I see it, the PLK300 has newer and faster units, whereas the PLTK300 (this Woot) has slower and older units.

Not Woot's fault, just Cisco's rather misleading naming conventions.

Regardless, great price, I'm in for one. Also because otherwise my parents will make me run Cat5e cables at their place (bad WiFi signals).

http://www.radioshack.com/search/index.jsp?kwCatId=&kw=linksys%20powerline%20network%20kit&origkw=Linksys%20Powerline%20Network%20Kit&sr=1

Looks like it's the $149 model. Not as good as the other model but still good price from woot. If it's hooked up to a router would that help with protection since it's only 56 encryption

dernst_ca1 wrote:I run mine through one.

I also run my iPhone streaming radio thru the in-house wiring using the 2 piece system I got in the recent Woot-off. I have a Squid type power strip at both the sending unit and the receiving unit and it works perfectly. It is not, however, considered a surge supressor, just a multiple outlet strip.

mattstl wrote:These are bad... very bad. All BPL (Broadband Power Line) networking devices use a very large amount of RF/Radio spectrum (constantly, whether data is passing or not) to pass the data for the network....

What does this do? Pollute the airwaves of people that need the frequencies from about 2-30MHz... Why do I care? Well it just happens that people like Red Cross, Marine HF, Shortwave radio, Amateur Radion, and other entities that need these frequencies during a disaster will be potentially impacted/interfered with by these devices.

so I guess the people in L4D n L4D2 was not heard for the initial evac b/c of this stuff being plugged to the wall and they couldn't receive the signal eh?

ROFLS!...plug one in and prepare for the apocalypse! cuz u wont hear 'bout the zombie attack until its too late!

ahulett wrote:EDIT - I'm confused. The top says PLTK300, but the description says PLTE200.

PLTK300 is the model of the kit. PLTE200 is the adapter with a single ethernet port and PLTS200 is the adapter with 4 ethernet ports.

Amazon has these individually at the list prices of $69.99 for the PLTE200 (currently on sale for $59.99) and $89.99 for the PLTS200 (currently on sale for $77.25). So it looks like if you want multiple adapters, buying multiple kits here is best.

I'm pullin an allnighter to study for a final... and I find myself wasting time on woot. Good thing no wootoff today

DOX
http://www.linksys.com/servlet/Satellite?blobcol=urldata&blobheadername1=Content-Type&blobheadername2=Content-Disposition&blobheadervalue1=application%2Fpdf&blobheadervalue2=inline%3B+filename%3DPLTE200_PLTS200_PLTK300_V10_UG_NC-WEB.pdf&blobkey=id&blobtable=MungoBlobs&blobwhere=1193821500066&ssbinary=true&lid=8028880111B05

or http://tinyurl.com/powerflakepdf


signal drop out seems to be an entertainingly common experience

http://forums.linksysbycisco.com/linksys/search?board_id=Wired_Adapters&submitted=true&q=PLTk300

with delightful suggestions "Change the MTU size to 1300 on linksys setup page"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sue1Zvmh8JA&feature=related

I think I'll just run wires in my walls at the new house. I have a basement so I'll be able to tell where there wall is. It might take more time but since I already have 2 50ft cat5 and 1 25ft cable I'll just stick with them instead of spending $125. Wired is going to be faster then anything else.

I'm a networking professional and I've lost count of how many times I've gotten a contract to wire a house with proper structured cabling after the homeowners tried similar (if not identical) 'powerline' network adapters.

They tend to be unreliable at best from what I've been told, and had one client get tired of waiting for a file to transfer (at a whopping 20KB/s), and got into the habit of just using a thumbdrive instead. Another had to unplug theirs as it generated a steady stream of static when they were trying to listen to the radio.

I haven't bought a set myself, for obvious reasons, and would caution others against these.

So I wouldn't be able to extend my cousin's internet to my grandmother's house next door which is adjoining? (but I'm pretty sure they're separate electrical, separate houses)

csimmon1 wrote:i wonder how well this works in old houses

I have the PLK300 which I believe is the "big brother" to this set in a fairly old house (built in the 1930's I believe, if not earlier) and it works quite well. I imagine the results should be similar with this set.

feralparakeet wrote:Apart from interference issues with cordless telephones that run on the 5.8GHz frequency, what exactly is the benefit of this kind of setup versus a standard wireless router? Is there some sort of distinct advantage, or is this for networking novices?

I live in a home where I've tried all kinds of wireless gear and I still cannot get a signal to the far end. So I decided to use powerline (the older PLK200). At the distance I am covering, much more reliable and far faster than what is possible at my site with wireless. I hang a wireless access point off the far end and that signal is far better than when I tried to do a 100% wireless extension across the same distance.

There is absolutely no reason to use these in a place where you get a nice strong wireless signal. If you want faster than wireless and you're that close, just run an Ethernet cable.

jeffiekins wrote:Is it Mac compatible?
According to this site, it IS Mac-compatible, provided you have (access to) a PC to configure it with. Once it's configured, you can use a Mac with it.

You do not need to configure the units. Only the security. If you didn't want to configure the security, you can simply plug and play the units and they will work with Macs or any other Ethernet device.

As a Mac user who has used PLK200 I want to pass on that I was not able to configure the security of my units using a Windows virtual machine under Mac OS X. The Linksys utility would not see the units through the Ethernet ports, even though the virtual machine has full connectivity all the way out to the Internet. I had to use an old actual PC laptop to configure the security. I did not try Boot Camp on the Mac. I do not know if the problem is fixed in the current Linksys utility or the PLK300s being sold here.

peach73 wrote:Anyone know the real range on this? Say for instance, would it work in a large business like a hotel with tons of power outlets or would there be a considerable drop/down grade in quality of the signal?

The real range is not predictable. It depends on the specific devices plugged in all along the circuits. In my case, I get great performance unless one specific fluorescent light fixture is turned on, then throughput drops to near zero. Also, throughput of my units depends on which electrical outlets they got plugged into, believe it or not, although I do think that is more of an indicator of how much my home wiring just suckks.

While some say these work in surge protectors and power strips, I'd say measure your throughput. While they're working, I'll bet your throughput is far slower than if you took the units off the surge protectors and plugged them directly into the wall.