I wonder about the reliability of Phillips: I've heard mixed things. I think I'd spend a small amount more and get a Panasonic.

kirkhilles wrote:I wonder about the reliability of Phillips: I've heard mixed things. I think I'd spend a small amount more and get a Panasonic.

According to PC World, they're average.

Here's the full article.

Had this TV. Within 2 months exactly half the screen went a purple shade. Although under warrenty, they wanted me to drive it an hour each way to drop it off and then drive back again to pick it up. Sent it back to store for refund although their phone person told me not to. Would not recommend.

JRElliott wrote:I've had two 32-inch Philips LCDs in my custody, both as a result of a Woot purchase, both 32-inch. I also have had two Viewsonic 32-inch models and I think I got the original from Woot many (five?) years ago as a refurb. None of these four has had dead pixels but I'd hesitate to generalize on that small sample.

-I recently bought the 22" Philips and it had 2-3 bad pixels in a group. The TV was for my Dad so I didn't return it.
I recently bought the Auria 26" (New, not refurb) and don't see any bad pixels.
I also bought 3 refurb 22" Soyo monitors from Woot all with large blocks of bad pixels. Sent them all back to Soyo, they sent me another 3 (all with ~10 bad pixels again). The 7,8,9th monitors we even worse, lines, flickering, etc.

I suspect most people wouldn't notice bad pixels, or couldn't be bothered enough to make a fus about it. (especially on 1080p because they'd be so small) so the reported buttafuocoures is probably less than expected.

If there was a big firmware glitch or common buttafuocoure that was repaired by the Manufacturer, then Refurb units are a go. But, you can be sure that when you or I bring back a monitor/TV because of 3-4 bad pixels, they just stick it back in a box and call it refurb.

--Scott

jgmcgowan wrote:This is the same price I paid for my 32" 720p Samsung last summer. Jealous, but thats technology.

I know what you did last summer....got beat out of $200

JRElliott wrote:Forgive my ignorance of pop (so-called) culture references, but would you explain your use of "buttafuoco", please?

Are you saying that some brand-new products you've purchased engaged in adulterous relations with other under-aged products and that subsequently, the under-aged products shot the brand-new products' spouses in their faces? And that the spouses survived the incidents? And that the brand-new products accused the under-aged products of the assault?

Or were the brand-new products convicted of solicitation, insurance fraud and parole violations on various occasions?

Interesting.

Well, it's possible, but Phillips products are more likely to be accused of mediocre or indifferent behavior, an M.O. that doesn't really gel with the felonies you describe.

You're probably right, and 'buttafuocoed' should more correctly be applied to mean 'a total and complete screw up with little hope of ever having a satisfactory resolution'.

bkOAiuXk wrote:Well, it's possible, but Phillips products are more likely to be accused of mediocre or indifferent behavior, an M.O. that doesn't really gel with the felonies you describe.

You're probably right, and 'buttafuocoed' should more correctly be applied to mean 'a total and complete screw up with little hope of ever having a satisfactory resolution'.

The original poster did not type the word "buttafuoco" - it's a Woot filter.

There were no 1965 Studebakers! They stopped making cars in '63! There was a 65 Avanti, but it was not actually Studebaker branded. Gosh, Woot, get your facts straight!

[/humorlessknowitall]

bradakovich wrote:Apparently, anything over 32" you can notice the difference between 1080p and 720p. Which makes TVs 32" and below the same from ~6 feet away.

The size of the screen doesn't matter at all, only how far away from it you sit. http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=cache:carltonbale.com/2006/11/1080p-does-matter/

any thing to be scared about buying refurbished?

As much as everyone is talking about the "P" in the 1080P, what is even perhaps more important is the refresh rate. On this TV it is only 60Hz, which is the bare minimum for TV's now days. You WILL notice blur in fast motion on this TV. The picture may be pretty, but it won't be seamless. If you want something for 500 bucks and you don't watch a lot of sports, action movies, or video games, this might be a good TV for you. Otherwise, you might be disappointed. Look for a TV with a refresh rate of at least 120Hz.

Actually, WalMart has the next best price

No RGB in? F a i l !

Can anyone comment more on the 90 day p and f warranty? Has anyone used it? Does anyone know how you would use it?

aanders1 wrote:Can anyone comment more on the 90 day p and f warranty? Has anyone used it? Does anyone know how you would use it?

I would guess you contact the manufacturer.

acrollins wrote:You WILL notice blur in fast motion on this TV. ... Look for a TV with a refresh rate of at least 120Hz.

No, on a 60Hz set you won't see blur. You'll see judder and you won't see it on broadcast TV.

TV signals are at 30fps and since the TV runs at 60fps, this means that each frame is displayed 60/30=2 times.

Movies, however, are at 24fps and 60/24=2.5, but since the TV can't display a frame a half-number of times, it compensates by displaying the 1,3,5,... frames twice and the 2,4,6,... frames three times. This is called 3:2 pulldown.

But judder is pretty hard to see except in certain situations. Smooth panning motions tend to show it the most (as you might see in a documentary or drama as an establishing shot). But it is unnoticeable during the fast motion of action and sci-fi. And it's unnoticeable during sequences where the camera is still or the motion is jerky.

In short, the only time 60Hz will be noticeable is in movies (not TV) when there is a slow pan of the camera. Otherwise, you'll never notice it.

do you have to buy replacement lamps for TVs like this? any idea how much they run and how long they last? i wonder how old the lamp is inside if refurb.

Just a quick comment on the "you need 120Hz" and "you need 1080p" arguments. Yes, more is better, but most of you are overestimating the visual acuity of most people's eyes.

The human eye is really poorly put together. We can only focus an image on a small part of our retina, we have terrible ghosting, poor lighting compensation, we loose color vision in low light situations, and we are blind with every blink and every movement of the eye. And these happen to everyone.

Then, you've got a large part of the population who are near-sighted or far-sighted or have astigmatism or glaucoma or retinal damage or corneal damage. And you might have one of these and not even know it.

So yes, a 1080p set looks better than 720p. And yes, 120Hz is more than 60Hz. But you're not going to enjoy a 120Hz set twice as much as a 60Hz one. The top of the line sets are already pushing the boundary of what our eyes can perceive.

This sort of discussion always reminds me of the plasma TV people. They say only plasma is good enough because they require a perfect picture, etc, etc--then sit and watch SD TV all stretched out so everybody looks like little dwarves.

But they're perfect little dwarves, I guess.

yazanh28 wrote:So the p stands for progressive as in the pixel lines on the TV are loaded progressively which is much better then when it used to be I or interlaced which means a line on the left loads while a different line loads from the right. The thing that most people don't know about 1080p and 720p is that you can only get 1080p from blu ray movies or upscaled dvds. When you are watching a show on TV that says HD it is actually only 720p which means getting 1080 while only watching television is pretty useless.

This is inaccurate. Most HD television channels broadcast in 1080i, while sports tends to be broadcast in 720p, as the progressive scan is better for capturing fast-moving balls and pucks. On a 47-inch screen, you will see the resolution difference between 1080i and 720p, although it will be more significant on even larger screens. You are correct that there are no broadcasts in 1080p, but Blu-ray players, Xbox, and the PS3 do support it over an HDMI connection.

cawfee wrote:Most modern PCs / laptops have a DVI out, which uses the same signal (digital) as the HDMI interface. If you have DVI out on your video card, you can buy a DVI to HDMI adapter for around $5 online and use that.

The cool thing about this is that most newer ATI cards (not sure about Nvidia) actually have on-board sound that can be output via the DVI -> HDMI connection, so all you need is an HDMI cable connected to your computer for both audio and video feed (this assuming that the ATI drivers work fine and your receiving device isn't weird). It works on my ancient 32" Olevia, I don't see any reason why it shouldn't on this set.

Something I missed in the description (it's in the product detail) is the 60Hz, which is decent enough for most TV and movie viewing; if you plan to do a lot of gaming however, look around for a 120Hz LCD or LED-LCD set instead, there's a visible difference between the two. Don't bother with the 240Hz, it's mainly just a marketing thing that has little to no real impact.

DVI's a pretty new standard as of this TV's release date. I'd say it's a bit premature to abandon it as of 2004 (when this TV was made) right around when DVI came out. My laptop's from 2006 and doesn't have DVI-out.


120hz isn't useful for gaming unless you're using a PC. Xbox and ps3 only output at 60hz.

I've had this tv for 2 years and not a thing has gone wrong with it.

LivingGhost wrote:The size of the screen doesn't matter at all, only how far away from it you sit. http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=cache:carltonbale.com/2006/11/1080p-does-matter/

The very article to which you linked says otherwise. Note that the x-axis of that chart is "screen size." At a given viewing distance (y-axis), the benefit of a particular resolution is visible only on screens above a particular size.




p.s. a shout out to a fellow ghost and all your jen.

60hz vs 120hz is really overstated for most applications; most 120hz TVs just interpolate frames to avoid judder, but don't actually take a 120hz signal and display it frame-for-frame.. the maximum most non '3D-ready' HDTVs will even accept as input is 60hz, if that.

Sure, you'll get judder when you're watching a 24/24.5fps movie if it hasn't already been sampled to 30fps (which a number of modern DVD players do internally already!), but most people won't even notice it.

As far as gaming goes, most review sites recommend turning OFF 120hz mode for video games, reducing/eliminating the interpolation for quickest response.
Short version, a majority of LCD monitors run at 59/60hz, and don't show 'judder' when gaming. Why would an LCD HDTV be different? It's just an extra-large monitor with a lower pixel density, a bunch of inputs, and TV tuner hardware built in with a little extra to try to be 'smart' about converting framerates.

cheroke55 wrote:[i]"It says P&F. Who is "Phillips & Fuani"

P&F USA, Inc.
3015 Windward Plaza, Suite 100
Alpharetta, GA 30005

It's 'Funai' and anything built with the Philips brand in the last couple of years originated with Funai.
From my personal service experience, I can state that Funai is the bottom of the barrel of manufacturers.
Philips sold name use and manufacturing rights for the US to Funai ~2-3 years ago.

Other Funai brands you might avoid:

Funai, Symphonic, Sylvania, Emerson, Aventura, Durabrand, ESA, Magnavox, Insignia and Misakai

Jwhildeb wrote:There were no 1965 Studebakers! They stopped making cars in '63! There was a 65 Avanti, but it was not actually Studebaker branded. Gosh, Woot, get your facts straight!

[/humorlessknowitall]

And the Studebaker didn't have positraction - no way it made those tire tracks.



edit: being a humorfulknownothing, I Googled and found out that lots of Studebakers did have positraction!

quantamm wrote:Just a quick comment on the "you need 120Hz" and "you need 1080p" arguments. Yes, more is better, but most of you are overestimating the visual acuity of most people's eyes.

The human eye is really poorly put together. We can only focus an image on a small part of our retina, we have terrible ghosting, poor lighting compensation, we loose color vision in low light situations, and we are blind with every blink and every movement of the eye. And these happen to everyone.

Then, you've got a large part of the population who are near-sighted or far-sighted or have astigmatism or glaucoma or retinal damage or corneal damage. And you might have one of these and not even know it.

So yes, a 1080p set looks better than 720p. And yes, 120Hz is more than 60Hz. But you're not going to enjoy a 120Hz set twice as much as a 60Hz one. The top of the line sets are already pushing the boundary of what our eyes can perceive.

I agree with what you said, although of course many of those visual problems you mentioned can be corrected.

I have a 3-year-old 60HZ 46" Sony, and to me it looks stunning when I'm watching a 1080p Blu-Ray. But as I've mentioned in earlier forums, I like to window shop for HDTVs regularly, and them most impressive feature I've seen in recent times is higher refresh rates on LCDs.

120HZ offers the advantage of being a multiple of 24, which makes for smoother reprocessing than 60Hz allows. But without getting all scientific, 120Hz dazzles when you're watching sports. The way I would put it, is that it's like watching slow motion when you're not. It's amazing how you can see that golf ball or hockey puck.

Still, 120 HZ TVs are expensive. I know that won't stop some people from complaining every time Woot offers a 60Hz model, but let's get real. A lot of people have a place for a TV at this price point, at which it's totally unrealistic to expect 120Hz.

This could be a great second TV - perhaps for the kids, or for a sun room where you don't watch that often. Other folks just aren't that fussy - you mentioned those with poor vision, and still others might only watch the news, or whatever.

Personally, I can identify with those who spend a lot more for a slightly better picture. I spent $1900 for the 46" TV that's in my office, and my main computer monitor was $1800. But that's me, and I'm fine driving an 8-year-old car. So, if you don't make fun of my car, I won't mock your monitor, except maybe if it says "Packard Bell" on the front.

So, I guess what I'm saying is, let's be productive and discuss this model for what it is. If you were a real estate agent, and a customer came to you with a $200K budget, would you tell him "I'd spend the extra money and get a mansion"?

markytee71 wrote:Frustrated at all the Philips bashing....

Let me put something into perspective? A lot of 'user reviews' (including here) tend to be negative because most normal content folk just don't take the time to praise a company's product. It's the people who got a defective product that lash out all over the internet to anyone who will listen to their anti product/company campaign. Philips is a mainstream and a reputable brand. Sure, they aren't exactly a Samsung or Sony, or Panasonic...but they make good electronics at a fair price for the average consumer. For every "F#CK PHILIPS" user review you see, there are tenfold more happy masses of Philips products. I am thinking most Philips users already KNOW that they aren't using 'the best' television or MP3 player so aren't inclined to sing Philips' praises on any review site. That doesn't mean that Philips products are 'sh&t' or that people don't like or use them, just that the only user reviews that usually show up are from the 'squeaky wheel' users that ended up with a product that slipped through QC (it happens) or are audio/videophiles of such magnatude that they shouldn't have bought it to begin with. I own and have owned SEVERAL Philips products and to this day have not one complaint. Consider this a 'positive web review'.

Perhaps you are one of the few lucky ones. I have a total of four Philips products. The DVD player is the only one that has performed as represented. Philips was once a great producer of electronics. They have gone the way of many of todays large companies. They survive on their past reputation, not on the current quality of their products. I predict that they become the next Emerson.

acrollins wrote:As much as everyone is talking about the "P" in the 1080P, what is even perhaps more important is the refresh rate. On this TV it is only 60Hz, which is the bare minimum for TV's now days. You WILL notice blur in fast motion on this TV. The picture may be pretty, but it won't be seamless. If you want something for 500 bucks and you don't watch a lot of sports, action movies, or video games, this might be a good TV for you. Otherwise, you might be disappointed. Look for a TV with a refresh rate of at least 120Hz.

That only matters with Blurays and even then, you need more than just more Hz to get seamless playback.

not 120hz
Nothing is 120hz, but it's an upgraded format for TVs this size.

I bought the father's day special woot tv which was pretty much this but with the feature that it upgrades the refresh rate regardless of the line-in refresh (virtually everything comes in at 60hz and upgrades, really noticable if used for a computer display).

LivingGhost wrote:The size of the screen doesn't matter at all, only how far away from it you sit. http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8&q=cache:carltonbale.com/2006/11/1080p-does-matter/

The size of the screen absolutely matters, according to both common sense and the link you provided.

Over the years lots of trouble with Phillips... but i keep buying em cause of price.

T.V. repair guy says the LCDs have far fewer parts (and weight) than the Plasma sets and that in itself makes them more reliable.

markytee71 wrote:TY. I wasn't done yet tho! Had this prepped to post:
[snip]
All that said, this a GREAT deal on VERY GOOD TELEVISION!!! I'd be in for one, but my apartment is tiny and a TV that size would have me at the chiropracter's office, my 40" is plenty. Go WOOT...Go Philips! And FINALLY...NO, I am not affiliated with nor paid to endorse Philips. I am simply a happy Philips' consumer that is just relaying my happy times with their products in the sea of negativity I see here and elsewhere on the net.

I have a Philips turntable that's over 25 years old. Still works great.

Not to p___ in anyone's cereal, but I hope those that purchased these aren't hoping to watch any sports, action films, or even PS3/XBox games on it... the refresh rate on this Television is horrendus compared to most other TVs out there. Most LCDs are at least at 120Hz, Good LED-LCDs are 240Hz, and Plasmas are upwards of 600Hz (that's 10 times this TV's rate)!

I got a Philips 47" refurb about 2 years ago. It cost $950 then. Still works great.

I just got rickrolled by Woot!
Grrrrrrr

NightGhost wrote:The original poster did not type the word "buttafuoco" - it's a Woot filter.

Yes, it's a Woot filter for 'f-a-i-l'.
However, the poster I was replying to did type 'buttafuoco' in his tongue in cheek post, to which I responded in kind.

A poor attempt at humor for which I apologize.

What the heck?!? Since Amazon took over, I don't receive notices of mailing, confirmation of purchase, delivery tracking dates, nothing. I always have to visit the site to find.. NO FURTHER INFORMATION other than you took the money out of my account.

Come on guys... people need to be available at home to get these things when they arrive. Have some respect for your customer's time!

Amazon sends me surveys asking for ratings on service before items have arrived on their home site - well, here you go.

"Get your act together and get information to the buyers to monitor the purchase and delivery in a timely manner. You are so much on 'auto pilot' that you are totally disconnected from the public and your customer's satisfaction. You remember us don't you? We put food on your table?"

That is my response to your survey.

k9taxi wrote:What the heck?!? Since Amazon took over, I don't receive notices of mailing, confirmation of purchase, delivery tracking dates, nothing. I always have to visit the site to find.. NO FURTHER INFORMATION other than you took the money out of my account.

Yeah my account shows me nothing other than I paid for it. Is it shipping soon or at all? I probably won't buy anything off of woot again because this is pretty terrible.

dear woot when are these going to ship?