and as a special bonus, made by slave labor in China so that they can make even more profit, rather than paying US workers a living wage, that they could use to buy overpriced electronics. Sorry, not for me.

Kacia wrote:My Touchpad is happily running Ice Cream Sandwich and does everything I need it to (including playing flash). I got it for $150 actually (32gig version). I have never understood why anyone would pay twice what the hardware is worth for the Apple label.

There are plenty of great Android tablets for under $300

iSheep love to buy apple products, I paid $200 for my refurb Lenovo Thinkpad android with 32 gig & 1 year warranty and I can add another 32 gig if i want to.

Get a new Nexus 10 instead. Android FTW!

I think it might be better for skipping ACROSS water then out a window though.

takethemeatbridge wrote:Yes! It will fit through most windows, but it may not survive the fall depending on the height of your building and the condition of the ground below.

You can buy me one if you want.

jbarnes85 wrote:Again, most tablets that are 9"+ and running modern software (not Gingerbread) are at the $499 price point. You just happen to own a failed product that was on clearance that has a similar screen size and could be modded to run ICS.

Yes, you can get OK 7" tablets for that cheap, but the only one worth any salt is the Nexus 7. Also, the flash argument is tired. Adobe doesn't even support it on the Android platform anymore.

The Nexus 10 starts at 399.

The touchpad only failed because HP is stupid. Though it very easily runs other ROMs so that's fine. Apple products are way too proprietary. People are paying a premium for the name. Not because it does a better job. I will say Macs can be more foolproof in some ways but that's because they so locked down.

In any case, this isn't so much an android versus apple battle, as it is an issue of price. I have a microcenter nearby if I wanted to buy a new one for $20 more.

takethemeatbridge wrote:Yes! It will fit through most windows, but it may not survive the fall depending on the height of your building and the condition of the ground below.

I always love a good defenestration joke. +1

Kacia wrote:The Nexus 10 starts at 399. The touchpad only failed because HP is stupid. Though it very easily runs other ROMs so that's fine. As a web developer and someone who builds my own machines, I don't buy hardware from a company that's so proprietary it won't let you replace a battery, and uses special screws to make it difficult to get into cases, etc. Don't get me started on the limitations they put on software... People are paying a premium for the name. Not because it does a better job. I will say Macs can be more foolproof in some ways but that's because they so locked down.

In any case, this isn't so much an android versus apple battle, as it is an issue of price. I have a microcenter nearby if I wanted to buy a new one for $20 more.

http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Installing+HP+TouchPad+Battery/6082/1

Good luck with that when it needs to be replaced. Your trolling is just so laughable. There are few tablets with easily user-replaceable batteries, let alone smartphones anymore. The ones that do have such horrible battery life you NEED to be able to swap it out.

Apparently the people here only like cheap things not good things. Not surprising for people too cheap to buy normally-priced items.

Wrong crowd to have an intelligent discussion about anything.

thekla wrote:and as a special bonus, made by slave labor in China so that they can make even more profit, rather than paying US workers a living wage, that they could use to buy overpriced electronics. Sorry, not for me.

Please name a computer maker who manufactures all products in the U.S. Then name a major company who increased wages in China (clue: Apple). That's not slave labor.

Lastly, realize a major reason Apple manufactures in China was the lack of engineers to run factories in the U.S. Look it up.

You know, I can go to a number of stores and buy a machine that will do what this does, has a significantly larger screen, AND has an actual keyboard and touchpad.... for LESS money. And it will have an optical drive, USB ports, Bluetooth, NIC, upgradable memory, replacable hard drive AND battery. It's called a laptop, and it's very nearly as portable as this thing. This device is a solution looking for a problem.

Kacia wrote:The Nexus 10 starts at 399.

The touchpad only failed because HP is stupid. Though it very easily runs other ROMs so that's fine. Apple products are way too proprietary. People are paying a premium for the name. Not because it does a better job. I will say Macs can be more foolproof in some ways but that's because they so locked down.

In any case, this isn't so much an android versus apple battle, as it is an issue of price. I have a microcenter nearby if I wanted to buy a new one for $20 more.

Also, nice job stealth editing your post about the battery and screws... My previous post has the full quote for those interested.

jbarnes85 wrote:http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Installing+HP+TouchPad+Battery/6082/1

Good luck with that when it needs to be replaced. Your trolling is just so laughable. There are few tablets with easily user-replaceable batteries, let alone smartphones anymore. The ones that do have such horrible battery life you NEED to be able to swap it out.

Apparently the people here only like cheap things not good things. Not surprising for people too cheap to buy normally-priced items.

Wrong crowd to have an intelligent discussion about anything.

MORE EXPENSIVE ne BETTER QUALITY.

jbarnes85 wrote:http://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Installing+HP+TouchPad+Battery/6082/1

Good luck with that when it needs to be replaced. Your trolling is just so laughable. There are few tablets with easily user-replaceable batteries, let alone smartphones anymore. The ones that do have such horrible battery life you NEED to be able to swap it out.

Apparently the people here only like cheap things not good things. Not surprising for people too cheap to buy normally-priced items.

Wrong crowd to have an intelligent discussion about anything.

I didn't "stealth edit" it. I edited it _before_ your reply. I felt that it was TMI. "Proprietary" defined it well enough. I wasn't hiding anything.

But in any case.. Trolling? My opinion is trolling? Your insulting me For my opinion is more an example of trolling than my opinion.

The touchpad was not simply "cheap", it had excellent hardware specs for the price. The OS that comes on it is actually very elegant, it just didn't gain the support necessary to become a hit.

In any case, I buy products based on whether or not they can do the job they need to do, and then I look at price. Apple products may do the job, but they never do it for the best price point.

As to the battery, it's not whether or not a battery is easily replaceable, it's whether or not it's meant to be replaced _at all_. It's bad enough when something is the most expensive in its segment, it's worse when it has planned obsolescence.

Apple fan boys get way too defensive when someone dares critique the brand.

Kacia wrote:I edited that post, btw. But in any case.. Trolling? My opinion is trolling? Your insulting me For my opinion is more an example of trolling than my opinion.

The touchpad was not simply "cheap", it had excellent hardware specs for the price. The OS that comes on it is actually very elegant, it just didn't gain the support necessary to become a hit.

In any case, I buy products based on whether or not they can do the job they need to do, and then I look at price. Apple products may do the job, but they never do it for the best price point.

As to the battery, it's not whether or not a battery is easily replaceable, it's whether or not it's meant to be replaced _at all_. It's bad enough when something is the most expensive in its segment, it's worse when it has planned obsolescence.

Sorry, your "opinion" has been coming off as trolling.

The HP Touchpad was not a value at $499 which is why HP killed the whole platform. Which is why you got it at $150 (at which point it was a decent value). If it were not for the third party modding community the TouchPad would still be running an unsupported version of WebOS, a defunct platform for which no apps will be made.

If you look across all segments of technology, from phones to tablets to cars, there are different price points, and even "luxury segments." A person in the market for a Ford Focus is not going to buy a Lexus IS350 and so on...

Apple created this "luxury" market (because MOST people don't NEED a tablet), and other companies are selling cheaper versions of what they created. So sure, you can buy something that costs less and does about the same, but it still pales in comparison when you take everything into account, such as the number of quality apps you can get, customer service, and longevity.

Clearly you have not been an Android user for long if you think Apple has more planned obsolescence. There are dozens of Android phones sold TODAY that do not support the latest version, and never will.

If that's not planned obsolescence, I don't know what is.

Kacia wrote:Apple fan boys get way too defensive when someone dares critique the brand.

Apple haters are oft-uninformed and spew the same mindless platform drivel. "Android is open, I can change the battery, I can add more memory."

90% of people don't care about any of those things and the other 10% are people like you who will do anything at all costs to AVOID Apple. Not because you think other people do it better, but because you hate Apple, for no good reason.

The landscape is changing, and more companies are doing exactly what Apple is doing - and none of those people are complaining.

jbarnes85 wrote:Sorry, your "opinion" has been coming off as trolling.

The HP Touchpad was not a value at $499 which is why HP killed the whole platform. Which is why you got it at $150 (at which point it was a decent value). If it were not for the third party modding community the TouchPad would still be running an unsupported version of WebOS, a defunct platform for which no apps will be made.

If you look across all segments of technology, from phones to tablets to cars, there are different price points, and even "luxury segments." A person in the market for a Ford Focus is not going to buy a Lexus IS350 and so on...

Apple created this "luxury" market (because MOST people don't NEED a tablet), and other companies are selling cheaper versions of what they created. So sure, you can buy something that costs less and does about the same, but it still pales in comparison when you take everything into account, such as the number of quality apps you can get, customer service, and longevity.

Clearly you have not been an Android user for long if you think Apple has more planned obsolescence. There are dozens of Android phones sold TODAY that do not support the latest version, and never will.

If that's not planned obsolescence, I don't know what is.

I wasn't telling people to run out and buy HP Touchpads. I said my Touchpad does everything I need it to do, and if it can't do something I can probably mod it so it can. Apple doesn't have that kind of flexibility.

As to Android... I don't blame the OS. It's more the phone companies that want to put their own skins on top of Android that are the problem. They also often turn off features because they want to force people to pay for them. Personally if I get another android tablet, it'll probably be a google nexus, as google is going to support android upgrades more than any other company would. Of course, older hardware, designed for a specific version of the OS will have limitations. I doubt all old apple hardware can run the newest version of their OS either.

The only thing "luxury" about Apple products are their looks. I've build machines that can run circles around Apple computers for half the cost. They're just not as pretty ;)

Kacia wrote:I wasn't telling people to run out and buy HP Touchpads. I said my Touchpad does everything I need it to do, and if it can't do something I can probably mod it so it can. Apple doesn't have that kind of flexibility.

As to Android... I don't blame the OS. It's more the phone companies that want to put their own skins on top of Android that are the problem. They also often turn off features because they want to force people to pay for them. Personally if I get another android tablet, it'll probably be a google nexus, as google is going to support android upgrades more than any other company would. Of course, older hardware, designed for a specific version of the OS will have limitations. I doubt all old apple hardware can run the newest version of their OS either.

The only thing "luxury" about Apple products are their looks. I've build machines that can run circles around Apple computers for half the cost. They're just not as pretty ;)

The iPhone 3GS (From June, 2009) can run iOS 6. I don't think any 4-year-old Android phone can run 4.0+

Have you heard of the term Jailbreaking? With Cydia you can mod your iOS device as well. Change everything about how the phone looks and operates too. I tried it once - I had too much freedom so I restored it to factory settings. /sarcasm

Also, I own a M/ac Mini (which you can't build yourself, for any cost) but I also have a custom-built-by-me PC for gaming. I know Apple's limitations, and I never expected my $499 micro computer to be able to do what my $999 custom PC can do.

The slash is because woot changes the word M/ac to typewriter...

jbarnes85 wrote:The iPhone 3GS (From June, 2009) can run iOS 6. I don't think any 4-year-old Android phone can run 4.0+

Have you heard of the term Jailbreaking? With Cydia you can mod your iOS device as well. Change everything about how the phone looks and operates too. I tried it once - I had too much freedom so I restored it to factory settings. /sarcasm

Also, I own a M/ac Mini (which you can't build yourself, for any cost) but I also have a custom-built-by-me PC for gaming. I know Apple's limitations, and I never expected my $499 micro computer to be able to do what my $999 custom PC can do.

The slash is because woot changes the word M/ac to typewriter...

"It is also important to note that unauthorized modification of the iPhone OS is a violation of the iPhone end-user license agreement and because of this, Apple may deny service for an iPhone or iPod touch that has installed any unauthorized software"

_Deny Service_. Change your own device's software and they can deny service. In any case.. when did this discussion become about phones?

Apple makes what they call high end machines too, you know. Their laptops cost about twice what a similar spec'd good brand PC laptop would cost.

jbarnes85 wrote:Apple haters are oft-uninformed and spew the same mindless platform drivel. "Android is open, I can change the battery, I can add more memory."

90% of people don't care about any of those things and the other 10% are people like you who will do anything at all costs to AVOID Apple. Not because you think other people do it better, but because you hate Apple, for no good reason.

The landscape is changing, and more companies are doing exactly what Apple is doing - and none of those people are complaining.

"People like me"? Why on Earth would I be against Apple except for the reasons I listed? People who dislike Apple products have _reason_ for disliking them. We don't simply say, "Oh I hate that logo, that company is eeeeeevil". LOL.

Perhaps you're thinking we have a similar mindset to those who are rabid fans of Apple and buy anything they put out, simply because it Is apple. If Apple put out a good product, that did what I needed it to do, for a good price, I'd buy it.

jbarnes85 wrote:Again, most tablets that are 9"+ and running modern software (not Gingerbread) are at the $499 price point. You just happen to own a failed product that was on clearance that has a similar screen size and could be modded to run ICS.

Yes, you can get OK 7" tablets for that cheap, but the only one worth any salt is the Nexus 7. Also, the flash argument is tired. Adobe doesn't even support it on the Android platform anymore.

That just shows the caliber of person who owns the junk tablets. I could have bought the HP tablet in 32GB for 99. I passed on it. I do own three iPads and am happy with them.

Kacia wrote:"It is also important to note that unauthorized modification of the iPhone OS is a violation of the iPhone end-user license agreement and because of this, Apple may deny service for an iPhone or iPod touch that has installed any unauthorized software"

_Deny Service_. Change your own device's software and they can deny service. In any case.. when did this discussion become about phones?

Apple makes what they call high end machines too, you know. Their laptops cost about twice what a similar spec'd good brand PC laptop would cost.

Go ahead and see if Google, or HTC, or Motorola, or Sony will support a device (phone OR tablet) with Cyanogen mod, or an unofficial ICS update. The short answer is: they won't.

There are no equals in the realm of notebook computing that have the same build quality (aluminum chassis) combined with features (connectivity, features, weight, size) that can match the MacBook line or beat it in price. Have you seen Ultrabooks lately (the only accurate comparison)? They are priced at or above what any MacBook is. And they're still made of plastic.

You really are grasping at straws here. I have shot down everything you have said to possibly put down Apple as, in some way, inferior to anything dozens of manufacturers are failing at successfully copying or improving.

You are saying you'd rather drive a Ford Focus than a Lexus or even a Lincoln. And that's fine. Because Apple's not marketing their products to you. But they are doing a better job at selling to everyone else who isn't holding on to the '90s-era idea that "Apple makes overpriced, underpowered products" party line.

Enjoy your unsupported TouchPad and your future-unsupported Android no-name tablet, if it doesn't say "Nexus" on it. And good luck - you'll need it.

Kacia wrote:Apple fan boys get way too defensive when someone dares critique the brand.

I used to hate apple and never owned any of their stuff. Then I bought my wife an iPhone and myself an iPod touch. Then I started using the app store. Now I own three iPhones, three iPod touches and three iPads. We use them everywhere. I like the apps they offer and that's what I pay for...

mdgore wrote:how in the hell does a tablet get run over by a car? I treat my tablet like it's a newborn (no shaking either).

My purse was stolen from my grocery cart. It was found in the parking lot with my cash gone but everything else there. Several items were pulverized and my purse was dragged (and ruined) on the pavement. I think the Milton didn't recognize the iPad in its leather case. I couldn't believe the glass didn't break. It still worked, but the display was a bit warped.